• 'Pregnant' Burglar Shot Dead By Homeowner
    372 replies, posted
[QUOTE=Gentry;45491597]do you own a firearm by any chance? [/QUOTE] Not in a lifetime. Guns are very dangerous things, & I'd never want to have one.
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;45491629]Hi, my name's gentry, and I CANT STAY ON TOPIC. I will bring up pointless hypothetical situations and off topic crimes to try and prove my point, then point and make fun of you when you don't follow my off topic crime posts and hypothetical situations. What does his ownership of a firearm have to do with the death of a pregnant female burglar? Nothing.[/QUOTE] huh why do you challenge me but no one elses opines? Such as the person I just quoted. Go rag on him for being off topic, without noticing the irony of your shitposting lol. Could you possibly be any more partisan
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;45491681]Probably because the guy you quoted didn't just spend a page and a half saying "YEA WELL HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT RAPE"[/QUOTE] well it proved how stupid his logic was so operation success I think but please continue to be more melodramatic
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;45491629]Hi, my name's gentry, and I CANT STAY ON TOPIC. I will bring up pointless hypothetical situations and off topic crimes to try and prove my point, then point and make fun of you when you don't follow my off topic crime posts and hypothetical situations. What does his ownership of a firearm have to do with the death of a pregnant female burglar? Nothing.[/QUOTE] so, i'm just wondering, if he hadn't had a gun, would he have run out and stabbed her to death?
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;45491708]No one was questioning the guy's ownership, gentry was asking steve stump if he owned a firearm. But, given this guy's reckless disregard for the law, yea, he probably would have tried.[/QUOTE] and, being an 80 year old man, would most likely not have succeeded
I don't often feel sick when reading headlines, and I've definitely read much worse, but for some reason this hit me a little. Maybe it's the cured sausages I just ate, but still. That's just unnecessary.
[QUOTE=Karmah;45489211]robbed with the intention of using their own children as a means to protect themselves. [/QUOTE] If someone was about to murder you, would you think 'Hmm, I really shouldn't bring up the fact that I'm pregnant. That would be immoral." or would you be PANICKING and say "PLEASE DON'T KILL ME MY BABY I'M PREGNANT PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE"
[QUOTE=ilikecorn;45491756]One could hope. On the bright side, given that he committed a firearm crime in the state of California, he's pretty much fucked. States have some pretty strict laws regarding use of a firearm in a crime, but California will lock you up and throw away the key. I honestly expect the jury to deliberate for like 10 minutes at the most before they convict him.[/QUOTE] He totally screwed himself with his statements. Even though it was outside the home, even though she was begging for her life, he STILL could have got away with it on a self defense claim. If he says she threatened his life so he shot her, who is going to argue that didn't happen? So he has to depend on jury selection, assuming there is no plea bargain. All his lawyer needs to do is find one person who hates criminals more than this guy for shooting a criminal.
[QUOTE=milkandcooki;45491519] whose fault is it that an old dude shot some lady? the old man? nah, the lady was asking for it![/QUOTE] Both sides are clearly in the wrong. She shouldn't been a criminal and he shouldn't have shot somebody who wasn't a threat. If she was a threat he would have been justified in shooting her but she wasn't. This is just murder.
[QUOTE=Karmah;45489084]This type of response from the homeowner should be expected. [/QUOTE] An execution should be expected? I can see somebody firing at burglars in the heat of the moment, but she was caught/unarmed/surrendered and he executed her to willfully spite the guy who got away. This is not an action that should be ''expected" of home owners. relevant (if it hasn't been posted already): [quote][media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDWo6m5hbG4[/media][/quote]
Good god people are defending this guy? Why the fuck do I stay on this forum...
Fuck them both.
God there hasn't been a thread like this in ages, and I missed it all.
Reading this has actually fowled up an otherwise amazing day. It doesn't matter what the legal standing is, it doesn't matter if it's retaliation, that's 100% cold blooded execution. If someone is being held at gunpoint begging for their life how is it impractical to hold them while keeping a safe distance? People don't deserve to die for burglarizing houses. I've done some pretty shady shit in my life, and I'm not proud of it at all (I must say I never did harm to an individual or robbed a house though) but thankfully life gave me another chance, and i learned to be a better person. Now I try to give love back to the world for everything I did wrong. It's actually so heartbreaking that some of the people on this forum are cynical enough to doubt a humans capacity for love and kindness based on a singular act. Good people can still make terrible mistakes.
I've done shady shit as well, and I KNEW getting shot and/or killed doing it was not only possible but it would be my fault. That's the risk of being a person who does stuff like that. He's still a murderer, but I can understand why he did it. It's not as if he's been randomly shooting up his neighborhood, he's not a danger to the general public.
What's with all these shady facepunchers?
regardless of the fact this old cunt straight up executed someone, the "dont rob houses when you're pregnant thing" is so fucking dumb and short-sighted yes there's lots of things you shouldn't do - don't rob houses - don't rob houses when the homeowner is in - don't rob houses when the homeowner is in and has a gun - don't rob houses when the homeowner is in and has a gun and you are pregnant do you really think a person who is likely to do these things is in a sound enough mental, social, and economic state to make those decisions? these are obviously the actions of a really fucking sad, desperate person. i don't know the woman and i don't want to assume or make stuff up for her defense, but jesus christ do you really think she just woke up one day with her boyfriend and said "you know what honey, i can't be arsed with work today, i think we should go and rob an old man because i'm a lazy bitch and i hate america" some people get dealt a pretty fucking bad hand in life. you know what doesn't help that? executing them
[QUOTE=carcarcargo;45500382]What's with all these shady facepunchers?[/QUOTE] if you said some of the posts here to a psychologist you would probably get committed
Reminds me of another story when someone robbed a store and as they were running away the shopowner followed with a shotgun. Shot one of them in the back, and surprise, surprise, that thread also had people defending the owner, despite him no longer being in danger. Robber later died I believe. How anyone can defend this man is beyond me.
[URL="http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/25/justice/california-slain-burglar-pregnant/"]CNN put out an updated story on this. [/URL] Looks like the decision on whether to charge the homeowner has still yet to be made. The press conference held by the police really does throw a lot of new information out there that to me makes the reasoning more understandable. He should be charged regardless, on what charges is debatable but he should still be charged. This might actually be late info, I only read the first few pages so I don't really know. *The woman wasn't actually pregnant as confirmed by the LA County Coroner's Office. *This was actually the 4th time that this guys house had been robbed. *The owner believed they were responsible for the prior robberies as well and was afraid that they may come back again in the future. *The owner was fairly viciously assaulted by the couple, suffering a broken collarbone, some cuts and some bruises. While none of this justifies his actions it does sort of humanize them. He isn't crazy, he just wanted vengeance against the couple since he thought they were responsible for past robberies (can't really be proven). That and he just wanted the robberies to stop. Obviously in the heat of the moment he went to far and shot the girl out of anger, he deserves to be charged for that but I think calling him crazy is a bit of an exaggeration once you hear more facts surrounding the whole story.
[QUOTE=Tsyolin;45501262][URL="http://www.cnn.com/2014/07/25/justice/california-slain-burglar-pregnant/"]CNN put out an updated story on this. [/URL] Looks like the decision on whether to charge the homeowner has still yet to be made. The press conference held by the police really does throw a lot of new information out there that to me makes the reasoning more understandable. He should be charged regardless, on what charges is debatable but he should still be charged. This might actually be late info, I only read the first few pages so I don't really know. *The woman wasn't actually pregnant as confirmed by the LA County Coroner's Office. *This was actually the 4th time that this guys house had been robbed. *The owner believed they were responsible for the prior robberies as well and was afraid that they may come back again in the future. *The owner was fairly viciously assaulted by the couple, suffering a broken collarbone, some cuts and some bruises. While none of this justifies his actions it does sort of humanize them. He should have just forced the girl to surrender and called the police to have her arrested. But he isn't crazy, he just wanted vengeance against the couple since he thought they were responsible for past robberies (can't really be proven). That and he just wanted the robberies to stop. Obviously in the heat of the moment he went to far and shot the girl out of anger, he deserves to be charged for that but I think calling him crazy is a bit of an exaggeration once you hear more facts surrounding the whole story.[/QUOTE] We have a charge for Heat of Passion killings. It's less than premeditated, and that's what he'll probably get charged with....
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;45501284]We have a charge for Heat of Passion killings. It's less than premeditated, and that's what he'll probably get charged with....[/QUOTE] That seems like the right course to take, which means it will probably get dropped from murder down to manslaughter. If that's the case he will be tried by jury and could see likely up to 11 years if fully convicted. That would be a pretty fair sentence if you ask me.
For some reason this story reminds me of one that happened two or so years ago. [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/04/23/youre-dead-chilling-audio-of-minnesota-homeowner-repeatedly-shooting-unarmed-intruders/"]Found it[/URL] Obviously not the same, but I remember this story appearing on facepunch. Was the reaction from most of the people posting the same?
[QUOTE=Grasp;45501371]For some reason this story reminds me of one that happened two or so years ago. [URL="http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/04/23/youre-dead-chilling-audio-of-minnesota-homeowner-repeatedly-shooting-unarmed-intruders/"]Found it[/URL] Obviously not the same, but I remember this story appearing on facepunch. Was the reaction from most of the people posting the same?[/QUOTE] I'm not sure (mostly because I wasn't around when this came up) but this case is a little more extreme. Those audio recordings give a pretty clear and concise message. You can't justify anything he did when all the facts came out, even if he was scared about being broken into the fact that he came out of his basement guns blazing (as if he was sitting there waiting to strike) all while saying what he did is shady as fuck. That guy was fucking insane, no doubt about it. He deserved his life sentence in prison.
[QUOTE=Tsyolin;45501353]That seems like the right course to take, which means it will probably get dropped from murder down to manslaughter. If that's the case he will be tried by jury and could see likely up to 11 years if fully convicted. That would be a pretty fair sentence if you ask me.[/QUOTE] All he was ever going to get charged with was manslaughter at the most. This wasn't premeditated. It was a heat of the moment thing, even without him being roughed up really bad....
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;45501483]All he was ever going to get charged with was manslaughter at the most. This wasn't premeditated. It was a heat of the moment thing, even without him being roughed up really bad....[/QUOTE] It was still voluntary though, heat of the moment or not, so he's gonna see either 3, 6, or 11 years as per the California Penal Code. I'll leave it up to the court to figure that part out.
[QUOTE=Tsyolin;45501512]It was still voluntary though, heat of the moment or not, so he's gonna see either 3, 6, or 11 years. I'll leave it up to the court to figure that part out.[/QUOTE] Of course it was voluntary. Nobody would dispute that. But he was never going to get full-on murder charges.....
[QUOTE=Silence I Kill You;45501526]Of course it was voluntary. Nobody would dispute that. But he was never going to get full-on murder charges.....[/QUOTE] He would have been charged for murder if the DA could prove that it was premeditated, which is extremely unlikely. So yeah you're pretty much spot on with that. [editline]25th July 2014[/editline] [IMG]http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/dam/assets/140725131420-gus-adams-andrea-miller-mugshots-story-body.jpg[/IMG] I'm also confused as to where this "fact" that the burglars were black came from...
[QUOTE=Tsyolin;45501546]He would have been charged for murder if the DA could prove that it was premeditated, which is extremely unlikely. So yeah you're pretty much spot on with that. [editline]25th July 2014[/editline] [IMG]http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/dam/assets/140725131420-gus-adams-andrea-miller-mugshots-story-body.jpg[/IMG] I'm also confused as to where this "fact" that the burglars were black came from...[/QUOTE] They could go after 2nd degree murder since he did go after them and killed a person. He intended on shooting that person, that does not equate to manslaughter or negligent homicide.
[QUOTE=UncleJimmema;45501714]They could go after 2nd degree murder since he did go after them and killed a person. He intended on shooting that person, that does not equate to manslaughter or negligent homicide.[/QUOTE] But that's entirely speculative. The court is gonna be the decider of that. If it's judged that this was a "heat of passion" killing they likely won't be able to pursue murder charges.
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