Skripal poisoning: OPCW confirms UK's analysis of nerve agent - Polidicks

It's funny because we wouldn't blink if an ex-british spy in Russia was killed by Russia if it spread over western news! Espionage is confusing.

Can you cite an example of an ex-british spy in Russia being killed by Russia and news of it spreading over western news?

No of course not it was a hypothetical situation. Are you insinuating that you would be skeptical? You haven't been particularly skeptical so far.

Reasons not to be particularly skeptical of the current Skripal poisoning situation: He was poisoned with a specific nerve agent invented by the Soviet Union. Modern-Day Russia is ruled by a former Soviet Union KGB Agent. He was a former Russian spy, who became a double-agent for The United Kingdom. He was killed in The United Kingdom. Reasons to be particularly skeptical of the current Skripal poisoning situation: You are a regular reader of 'Fake News' websites. You subscribe to conspiracy theories. You are a victim of brainwashing. You do not look into the finer details of events. You're a Russian shill posting from a VPN (..?) The reason I asked you for an example of your aforementioned terrible hypothetical is not because I know you couldn't provide one - that's obvious enough - but rather because I wanted to see why you'd make such a silly post in the first place. From what possible perspective are you seeing this event unfold, almost before your very eyes, and finding yourself at the foolish conclusion that Russia did not poison the Russian ex-spy, gone double-agent for the UK, in the UK along with his daughter? Seriously, how do you find yourself at such a conclusion with the given information?

Why would your government ever poison a retired spy of a foreign country, and his daughter, and a bunch of other people, despite him being a double agent in favor of the UK?

You have to understand why I am laughing that you are accusing me of being a Russian shill while also accusing me of subscribing to unfounded conspiracy theories. Firstly, I do not read RT regularily, nor do I take it seriously at all what so ever. In fact I have been going on it over the last week or two since the Syria situation to see what the other side has been saying about it. Not something you would do I'm sure, you get all you need from your glorious leaders. I'm not even saying that Russia didn't do it, in fact on multiple occasions I have stated that they probably DID do it, however as with the Syrian chemical attack no evidence has been brought forward and only that the agent used could be linked to Russia. My argument to that would be why would Russia be stupid enough to poison it's own agents with a toxin that could only possibly linked to them, your average facepuncher has more common sense not to do that I would assume. What you are getting confused is me being skeptical with me being FOR Russia. I have spent lots of time in the Baltic nations and know very very well what the Russian Government is like and the bullshit they can put out to the world around them. At the same time I have grown up in a country that has had arguably one of the most effective intelligence agencies in the world and old enough to have seen the last 15 years of international politics to have a natural distrust of the reactionary bullshit narratives we get fed before being pushed into conflict. So if I were you I would stop listening to CNN or MSNBC or whatever because they are feeding you with too much RUSSIAN DISINFO AGENTS BE FUCKING UP OUR COUNTRY when unfortunately your country put that orange crumpet in power itself and none of you can take the fucking shame of it.

My argument to that would be why would Russia be stupid enough to poison it's own agents with a toxin that could only possibly linked to them, your average facepuncher has more common sense not to do that I would assume. Presumably because they know that, no matter what, they can spin the story so that people will believe western governments are somehow responsible no matter how much evidence exists to the contrary. And that the people who do know better can't do anything about it anyway.

We can presume this yes, it's just a little convenient for me. If this was a case of man found in hotel room dead from hanging or whatever I would be 100% behind you however with this little added hint of "Russian Nerve Agent Used" is causing some pretty huge flags to pop up, especially considering the recent goings on in Syria. All of it is relating to the use of chemical weapons, which is one of the last agreed causes the UN has to start military operations on a foreign government. I believe that there is some reason to doubt that Russia did this, I also believe there is reason to believe they did do it. Surely you can see where I am coming from?

It's akin to the people who believe that all of the recent shootings in the states are part of an elaborate ploy with paid actors, if the american government was so evil as to orchestrate this elaborate plan and kill anyone who finds out about it, why wouldn't they just pay some violent assassin to shoot up a school instead of an entire troop of actors. Russia doesn't need to come up with an elaborate scheme to cover up state sanctioned killings, because they know that a large number of people won't believe they ordered the hit no matter what. There's a huge precedent of people criticising the russian government winding up dead or in prison, it's not as if it's as much of a stretch considering all of the other high profile assasinations linked to Russia. Heck, they've even killed another former russian spy in britian using a substance that can only have come from russia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/real-life/news-life/heres-a-list-of-all-the-putin-critics-who-wound-up-murdered/news-story/4e2952b107b0c7159887e303062c9694 https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/03/23/here-are-ten-critics-of-vladimir-putin-who-died-violently-or-in-suspicious-ways/?utm_term=.85a73bbab65a https://www.businessinsider.com.au/list-of-people-putin-is-suspected-of-assassinating-2016-3?r=UK&IR=T What's more likely, that all of the dozens of suspicious deaths of people who criticize or undermine the russian government are a part of some elaborate ploy by someone to make russia look bad, or maybe, just maybe, the highly corrupt ex-KGB agent who runs the country as a functional dictatorship actually has political opponents executed or imprisoned in order to maintain power?

I would have to protest that this is anything akin to the conspiracy theories about paid actors in America, which is pretty fucking nuts and easily disproved. What I think this is more akin to which I wouldn't have argued with, is the 9/11 attacks and the WMD accusations against Saddam that led up to the war in Iraq, half of which has been proven to have been propaganda as a pretext to an invasion of a previous ally of the US. I absolutely agree with you with regards to the Russian tendency to assassinate not only ex agents but reporters and many open dissenters.

I wasn't arguing that mass shooting conspiracy theories and believing russia isn't responsible for politically sanctioned killings is equivalent. I was using it as an example of how it is a stretch to argue that there is an elaborate ploy to frame russia as responsible for all of these politically sanctioned assasinations instead of, y'know, maybe Russia actually has its political opponents executed because it's a corrupt oligarchic regime run by an ex-KGB agent? Why would Russia need to cover up it's assassinations if people will always blame the western governments for everything they do?

I think the media and public outcry, along with me being a stark minority in expressing any doubt on this forum that very little people are blaming western governments for this, and neither am I particularly, I'm simply expressing doubt and in this day and age I would require more evidence before I myself pointed a finger at anyone. On the side note, I believe we are living in a dangerous time for open debate and argument by the fact that in this and the Syria threads since this began, I have been called a disinformation multiple times, I'm not offended or anything, I just find it quite troubling that this might set a precedent for the future of things to come.

Like I said in the edit of the previous post, these things are not done for the benefit of this country or the people on this forum. It's done to affect people in Russia, especially those who might want to challenge the existing regime.

While I wasn't criticising you directly, your other posts on this topic have made your agenda pretty clear and it's not hard to see why you'd jump for a source that supports your view, even one as biased as RT.

If a messenger signs up to posting a poor and well known to be biased source he shouldn't be upset when people call him out on it, nobody held you at gunpoint to post it.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-43835774?intlink_from_url=http://www.bbc.com/news/topics/c0j915myy8kt/russian-spy-poisoning&link_location=live-reporting-story I don't feel like making a new thread, so I am posting this into the most recent thread about the poisoning.

Killing the cat was probably unnecessary