Teen Taken at U.S. Border Tells of Icebox Cages With 60 Girls - Polidicks

1) you support internment camps where families are broken apart and subjected to torture conditions. 2) I don't even need a second point.

but really what is the point of slicing at them, calling them out, ect. at this point? it won't stop these camps, all it is is more useless talk, an open invitation to a circlejerk.

Which is why I voted for Clinton in 2016, in spite of owning guns. I've said it before, I'll say it again; I'd prefer to have the Democrats in charge and fight them over the 2A than have the Republicans in charge and watch as they ruin literally everything they touch except the 2A. Which is what's happening now. Hell, I barely trust them on the 2A, they only seem to care about it when election season rolls around, use it to drive votes. I can't be the only one in here who remembers Donnie saying something along the lines of "forget due process, confiscate first". I suspect that the Republicans will abandon us gun owners as soon as we're more trouble to them than we're worth.

Okay, so it is just safe to assume that your post was nothing more then masturbatory attempt to get some epic zingers. So good job for the high quality shitposting and avoiding responding to a direction question i asked you. I think he missed the main point, but what he said does hold a some truth. Imagine being told your 2nd amendment rights are outdated, stupid, and not needed. Imagine having to listen to gun owners getting their character assassinated everyday on television, their hobby attacked, ideals which are apart of their identify attacked. Imagine the frustration of seeing legislation being proposed for decades by legislators who clearly do not know what they're talking about. Now I understand that there are a lot of various people who support second amendment regardless of political affiliation, at the flip side there are people regardless of political affiliation who are against the 2nd amendment.One of the biggest thing is people say they need guns to fight the gov't. Most people who are against the 2nd amendment say that is bullshit. Now imagine this back and forth going on for decades, most democrats are against secondment amendment (or at least the majority of the party is). Imagine being asked to take up arms by the same people who are quick to dismiss you and attack your own beliefs...it is pretty hypocritical. No one should be surprised by the response or unwillingness. OR at least that is the point I think he was trying to make. That being said though, regardless of what happened and what I stated above...it shouldn't make it acceptable or okay to dismiss what is happening. If anyone uses that as their sole excuse for not being active in any form as you stated it just means that they're using it more of an chicken shit excuse. I believe there are people in this country who are willing to raise arms against the gov't. Providing the conditions are right and the gov't is to far gone. While what is happening is disgusting against due process and unconstitutional, political and legal options have not been exhausted. There still has to be legal action, political action, and lawsuits. But, your point is absolutely right it is pretty hypocritical to say someone is for the constitution but perfectly okay with due process being violated. It is pretty safe to say that people who think what is happening is good or acceptable are morally bankrupt. There are many people who are against it, but may not be in a position to do anything about it other then pass information along and write to representatives. There are many people who are against it and doing something in an attempt to change it. Then sadly there are prolly people who just don't care, may not be racists or anything but just don't care because it doesn't affect them. Though, it might not mean much but this policy and what is happening is very unpopular. Alot more republicans are against this then I originally believed. https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/230446/0d4bfb62-3158-4251-a606-873517776633/Capture.PNG Yeah, I agree 100 percent with you. I think I poorly explained my original position on the matter when I posted. What I ultimately wanted to say is most administrations want to combat illegal immigration and make promises to do so. It is a hot button issue and want to score political points. But, you are right none of them have deployed these tactics to bring immigration to a halt. It is pretty clear from this administration gesturing they are motivated by racist ideals. I just don't think peoples stances are as black and white as people make it to be. I think there are people who like for this policy because of racist ideals, I think there are people who genuinely are misinformed and don't understand the gravity of the situation other then illegal immigrants are being deported, and then you have people who do not think this acceptable. I think our gov't has been out of touch for a long time now, a lot of the stuff which happens behind the scenes is being flagrantly thrown in our faces now. This administration is easily the most worst and depraved administration, hopefully we don't get anymore.

The simplest test by which to measure whether somebody is a good person is to ask them whether they would still vote for Donald Trump. Trump's regime is a blight on the history of this country -- one more national disgrace among many. To any who still stand by the mad king: fuck you. Nothing else. Just, "fuck you."

You remind me of that one dude who posted on facepunch who thought putting landmines across the entire us/mexico border was a good idea. I would encourage you to reexamine your moral priorities.

Nothing, It's hyperbole. Every time a bunch of kids get gunned down, one of the less sensible arguments against gun control is that the 2nd amendment safeguards Americans from tyranny. The idea is that a corrupt, fascist, or otherwise tyrannical government could never gain traction in America because they would have to tread super carefully lest the armed population rise up against them. And now America has an incredibly corrupt administration with ties to hostile foreign powers, open courtship of facists and neo-nazis, and even the first signs of fucking concentration camps starting to spring up- and these same self professed defenders of freedom and liberty are just nodding along with it. ~they are just enforcing the law!~ ~at least they aren't the democrats!~ If you are happy to see every other right burned so you can keep hold of your guns, then eventually you wont have anything left to defend with them.

Sure. The first step of that is to get people to see just how awful and ridiculous this is. It's not a circlejerk if it's literally true. There are actual nazi sympathizers who are actually advising the President who actually are racist anti-Semites who actually want Trump to be an authoritarian dictator. We are but a single step away from tyranny and the rise of a second (crypto)Nazi party.

I like how it's a "pipedream", just like, really hard so why would we even bother? This is how conservatives think.

Speak for yourself, drooler. Rhetoric like that won't make me warm to compromise with the left but it damn sure won't make me support Trump.

Make it happen. A revolution in th US would inspire revolutions areound the world, altough it would depend on what kind of revolution we're talking about

So just for the sake of this argument and because of what others been saying... If this is true and we are one step away from Tyranny and being dominated by a orange neo-nazi then why are people who believe what you said not taking up arms? Why are you waiting for others do it for you?

They're not. This is the thing you seem to be misunderstanding, most of these people aren't actually calling for anyone to take up arms, they're pointing out the hypocrisy of people who claim to be "the last line of defense against tyranny" and yet aren't willing to do anything to oppose actual government oppression when it happens, and in fact in many cases are in support of it. Also just because we aren't taking up arms doesn't mean that we're not doing anything. Unlike the aforementioned self-proclaimed "defenders of freedom", left-leaning folks are actually going out and protesting, they're writing to representatives, they're actively speaking out and making it clear that they won't tolerate this kind of injustice.

Do you believe it's time for an armed revolution? I'm a gun owner and pro-2A. I don't think an armed revolt is a rational response at this time. There are "2A people" on your side. You're painting with too wide a brush.

Do you believe that the 2nd amendment is a genuinely effective deterrent against government oppression and that gun owners are the "last line of defense" against tyranny? If not, then that line isn't aimed at you. It's not criticizing gun ownership, it's criticizing people who believe that they are freedom fighters that are warding off oppression because they are gun owners. There are plenty of perfectly rational arguments for gun rights. The laughable idea that it does absolutely anything to intimidate corrupt authority figures in America is not one of them.

you've completely changed your argument.

It isn't there to intimidate them, it's there to make sure they can be flushed out if all else fails and push really does come to shove. It's there to make sure there's arms available to the people if our system is subverted. Trump really wishes he could be a tyrant, but right now all he has are executive orders and corrupt officials. We just aren't there yet.

of course we should keep protesting and keep hammering on our representatives and keep being loud, but i see so many left-leaning people who don't seem to have any backup plan at all while actively deriding the idea that people owning guns might be helpful in the instance that violent revolt becomes the only option. it just seems short-sighted and frankly stupid.

But we are danger close to it.

Imagine if your air bags went off whenever you almost hit a car.

Imagine if you chose not to swerve because you were certain a car would just miss you.

If it comes to that, he who lives by the sword, can also just as easily die by the sword

this precisely is why i think far more left-wing people should own guns and form militias, the second amendment isn't restricted to the right-wing.

I think the bigger thing here is that he characterizes criticism of ICE and arbitrary, indefinite detention as being for open borders. Trump himself has said the same thing, that if you oppose his immigration policy then obviously you want open borders and support MS-13 invading to burn our women and rape our churches.

How so? Me personally? Wait for elections and vote. If it turns out that either the populace or the system itself is so far gone that electing out these people is not longer possible, leave. Which is a fantasy. We don't live in the 1700s anymore. An armed revolution overthrowing the US government in the modern day is simply not going to happen especially considering that most of the gun owning demographic of America would be on their side. Yes, not everyone that owns a gun in America is pro-Trump, or pro-GOP, or anti-immigrant etc. but an extremely significant number of them are, and that's a problem when even every single gun owner combined taking on the US government and winning is ridiculous. I'm honestly pro-gun rights for the most part, but the delusion that gun ownership is going to do anything to protect against tyrants is actively harmful. It leads to the kind of people who happily throw away all of their other rights so long as they get to keep their right to bear arms because they've been fed the deluded idea that as long as they have that, all of the others can be protected.

The hypothetical societal collapse isn't as impossible as people think. That isn't to say I think it's going to happen, but it's not that hard to imagine a nightmare scenario in which we could actually reach that point, especially with the political arena being what it is. It's important to keep in mind that if it were to come to it, it's generally expected that the majority of the military would be on the side of "the people", whichever faction that is, rather than automatically siding with the government. Our troops are not brainwashed hordes; they're citizens with the same fears that we have and I can't imagine in this modern connected world that more than an extremely small minority of the US armed forces would be willing to fire on civilians. The real problem with the idea of a revolution - this is what scares me about it, personally - is that it's basically impossible that "the people" would actually form one unified force with a single leader and a cohesive plan for the future. It would bring our country to its knees and the only group with the organization and connectivity to establish a successor government would be the military, regardless of how well intentioned most military personnel would be that isn't an ideal outcome. Anyway, to me, 2A is like keeping a fire extinguisher in your car. It's there in case of emergency... not because you're pretty sure your car will catch on fire.

This is of course contingent on the military seeing any revolutionary faction as "the people." Keep in mind that these revolutionary forces are probably not going to be that large in size, especially considering that they'd likely be split up across multiple likely opposing factions, as you said. Very few members of the military may be willing to stand by the killing of civilians (although considering our track record, I don't know how much I actually buy this), but "terrorists" trying to subvert the government and making attacks on US soil, on the other hand...

It wasn't so tough in the 60s - bring in foreign (not local) troops and tell them "these commies are trying to undo america" and they're perfectly willing to fire on protesters. But that lie couldn't hold up today as connected as everything is and most soldiers live near where they're stationed. What I mean is, like, if something happened that tripped a large scale uprising I think most troops would refuse orders to engage them. We're talking a dogwhistle major abuse situation that actually merits an armed revolt, not odd lunatics like McVeigh... since that's what 2A is aimed at. It's pretty hard to hypothesize about what would happen but I think we can all agree we'd rather it didn't. But I want the option to be there in case we reach a point where throwing the entire country into chaos would be preferable to whatever type of systemic abuse begins to occur.

Left Wingers used to support firearm ownership, and forming militias. I don't know when they started losing their skin to fight things, but need I remind that Mother Jones didn't win union rights by doing favors behind a barn, she won them by shooting the corrupt fuckers who tried shooting them first.

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