May-Corbyn Brexit TV debate isn't happening after all
18 replies, posted
Channel 4 has announced it will hold a debate on Sunday featuring neither Mrs May or Mr Corbyn, but "four high profile politicians" - one backing the PM's deal, one behind a softer Brexit, one for a harder Brexit and one supporting the People's Vote.
It has not confirmed who the politicians will be.
Is this the same as BBC Drop Plans for Brexit TV Debate?
Nah ITV was still planning to hold one but that's gone now too
Oh shit, why's everyone dropping them?
May and Corbyn can't agree on the format
Combination of not being able to get them to agree to it and not the channel not wanting to get any skidmarks I would wager
How very professional...
And they're expected to be able to make a deal with the EU when they can't even make a deal to show up to a TV debate?
Guess the British didn't want to witness murder on live television.
May accepted the BBC's format which would have had a panel of other politicians and members of the public. Corbyn accepted ITV's which was a straight head-to-head.
But then May's "national tour" has been cut as it's obvious her deal isn't getting through so the whole thing would have been even more meaningless (in the sense that the viewing public don't have a bloody say in the whole thing).
Tomrrows rag headline: "COWARDLY COMMIE CORBYN DROPS OUT OF DEBATE IN FEAR OF MAY'S COLLOSAL IRON FORM"
BBC's format sounded more interesting to me
I say this as an American of course but British politics is so fucking baffling to me, what's the point of this debate? What's the position Corbyn going to argue? And May? Corbyn is pro-brexit, May was anti-brexit but became pro-brexit to save her party. If the LibDems and SNP participated I'd maybe see a point to offer an actual alternative pro-EU viewpoint.
Eh. A head-to-head would be best because it's Leader v Leader. It can be hard to emulate that in Parliament because of the 648 other MPs. From experience, let me tell you that debates that incorporate the LibDems / Greens / SNP / Plaid Cymru sort of fall flat on their face because a lot of people share the same sentiment: why am I watching altercations between parties that I'm never going to vote for? Third-party voting isn't dead in the water in the UK but at the same time the current threat of any party other than the Tories/Labour is minimal at best, so a head-to-head between Corbyn and May sort of chops that away.
Nonetheless, a head-to-head would never work in this instance, because different personalities have different arguing methods; Theresa May seems to do better when surrounded about her peers, who can sort of be rallied by her potential to be condescending and scathing. On the other hand, there's Corbyn who can bite back in Parliament but is still a bit of a pushover --> A head-to-head would allow Corbyn to rip vulnerable May to pieces, whereas a large panel featuring the two would swing the balance in May's favour where there's a higher chance of Corbyn being pushed around by everyone else. May doesn't seem eager to go near head-to-head debates, and though Corbyn would take part in a panel style debate, he risks shooting himself in the foot.
Say what you will about David Cameron, but he could hold his own in both styles of debate, as could Ed Milliband, albeit to a lesser extent.
If the UK lets me down come the next election and votes the Tories in again, I swear I will finally die inside. That other thread regarding Brexit is not helping at all
I'm highly doubting a Tory win, and I think a strong Tory majority is impossible. Theresa May is mocked by most of the country, and the situation is made worse when you realise she's one of the few people that could actually run the Conservative Party at the moment. People like Rees-Mogg and Boris are too unpopular or aren't taken seriously, former cabinet members such as Priti Patel have controversy. Andrea Leadsom will never be leader, and then you get left with either backbenchers or rarely mentioned cabinet members. Penny Mordaunt? Losing popularity because she's been a bit sneaky and conniving lately, though much can't be expected of politicians. The Conservative Party is running out of electable ministers, whilst the Labour Party has plenty ready to step up to the plate, even if they are a tad annoying or under performing in their departments.
David Cameron received a lot of criticism during his time as Prime Minister, but even when he was eating a hot dog with a knife & fork he somehow managed to push down the image of 'All Tories are heartless cunts'. Remember that it was under Cameron that same-sex marriage was passed, even if his stance on the matter has been shaky through his political career. Even as an Oxbridge stereotype, he was self-aware and, if you completely remove his actual politics from the matter, he wasn't bad at his job. He tried his best to work with the EU. The Conservative Party lacks good moderate conservatives nowadays because the priority of the ministers is to climb ladders and organise power plays against each other. So, once Theresa May either resigns or gets the boot, the Tories will find themselves in quicksand as they scrape together a potential candidate for leadership.
As long as Labour don't see the Tories shooting themselves in the foot and decide to try and one-up them by shooting themselves in the face, patience will win the next election. Oh and also don't use the Hillary Clinton strategy of just assuming you'll win. I think the greatest risk to a future Labour government is Corbyn's image; Milliband could've gone on holiday and won the next election with his eyes closed. Well, assuming he didn't make another monolith of manifesto promises.
Unfortunately I can't see a labour government with Corbyn at the helm. The media smears have largely been successful and the economic illiteracy pushed by the Tories is still the predominant view. Since 2008 the Tories have successfully painted Labour as literally unelectable and irresponsible. He's done what he can and swung the party to where it needed to go. I feel eventually he'll step down and let Keir Starmer or some other such minister take the reigns but I don't feel in any rush for that to happen.
It doesn't help Corbyn wants for UK to leave EU too.
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