• New York state indicts Paul Manafort for 16 unpardonable crimes
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https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/13/nyregion/manafort-indictment.html Paul J. Manafort, President Trump’s former campaign chairman, has been charged in New York with mortgage fraud and more than a dozen other state felonies, the Manhattan district attorney, Cyrus R. Vance, Jr., said Wednesday, an effort to ensure he will still face prison time if Mr. Trump pardons him for his federal crimes. News of the indictment came shortly after Mr. Manafort was sentenced to his second federal prison term in two weeks; he now faces a combined sentence of more than seven years for tax and bank fraud and conspiracy in two related cases brought by the special counsel, Robert S. Mueller III. The president has broad power to issue pardons for federal crimes, but has no such authority in state cases. The new state charges against Mr. Manafort are contained in a 16-count indictment that alleges a yearlong scheme in which he falsified business records to obtain millions of dollars in loans, Mr. Vance said in a news release after the federal sentencing. He could face up to 25 years in New York state prison if convicted of the most serious charges in the new indictment, which is expected to be announced later on Wednesday.
Enjoy the rest of what's left of your life in prison, dead man. Nobody's saving you from this.
I hope Manafort sees this and starts squealing like a pig.
Why does it feel like our legal system works on playground rules? I'm half-expecting someone to bust out the old "everything-proof shield" at this point.
Orange in Chief is just childish enough to try...
Welcome to Calvinball.
These are state crimes which he cannot pardon if I remember correctly? So this should properly nail Manafort
How would this sentencing work with the other one he got. Do they stack up?
I believe that because they are totally separate charges in two totally separate jurisdictions, the sentences would need to be served consecutively. But I'm not 100% sure.
law is a hilariously cobbled-together system of bizarre contradictions and well-reasoned bullshit. it basically is a game. A game with incredibly high stakes and an incredibly important role in society, but a game nonetheless. this is one of the great things about jurisdiction. which can get confusing as hell.
state crimes, he's basically going to spend the rest of his life wrapped up in either prison or court rooms.
That is the idea, yes. POTUS cannot pardon state crimes, only federal crimes, so they're filing this indictment as insurance that Manafort will spend time in jail come hell or high water.
Imagine being Manafort, you get the world's lightest sentence and a slap on the wrist from a racist judge and then NY is standing behind him with a baseball bat cheerfully asking how much he likes his kneecaps.
Reminds me of that Simpsons episode when the judge is sentencing Bart to a very light sentence, but suddenly hits vacation time, exchanges shifts with a super strict judge, and she gives Bart one hell of a sentence instead. Except this time its absolutely fun.
Can't Trump/GOP/whataver pass a law to make state crimes pardonable? I don't realy know what currently the president can do.
SHHH! They'll hear you!
Would that technically be obstruction of justice within this context?
Surely it has been obstruction of justice in just about every context for the past Two Years.
Right now the Democrats have control of the House and they'll see the intent of such a move from a mile away. You need approval of the House, Senate, and President to pass a law and ever since the midterms the Republicans now only have two out of three. It's gridlock, but only in the same way a gauze is gridlock to bleeding out.
I mean, they could pass that law but it wouldn't be valid. It would be like passing a law saying the president can pardon crimes in Uzbekistan - states are sovereign in regards to their own criminal law, it's the governor of a state that has the power to pardon state crimes. And really, a pardon is just a formalization of an implicit power of the executive branch - the judiciary can sentence someone to whatever they want, but it's the executive branch that has to carry that sentence out, and if they just refuse to do it, there's nothing that can be done. An explicit pardon makes that less arbitrary - a future executive can't undo it - but the core power would be there regardless. The President lacks that implicit power for state crimes because it is not federal employees who carry out punishments, but state ones - people commanded by the governor, not the president. Of course, this is sort of pretending that laws are actually absolute. In practical terms, all law is just a convention most people have chosen to follow. If Congress passes a law saying Cheeto can pardon state crimes, and enough people believe that makes it true... it is true. If the wardens let you out of jail and no cops will arrest you, you're pardoned, no matter how shaky the theoretical basis is. (This is why a lot of founding fathers opposed a Bill of Rights - it doesn't matter what rights a piece of paper says you have, only what other people say you have. If 90% of Americans suddenly decided the government could forcibly quarter troops in private homes during peacetime, the Third Amendment wouldn't do jack to stop it.)
https://www.law.com/newyorklawjournal/2019/03/12/ny-lawmakers-expected-to-pass-bill-closing-double-jeopardy-loophole/?slreturn=20190214150336 The Manhattan DA is a known Trumpster and helped his family before, he may have done the indictments to run afoul of the state's special double jeopardy law but they're fixing that.
This would be an attack on the sovereignty of the States, as far as I'm aware. Pardon power is granted to the President by the Constitution, and only for federal crimes.
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