Carmack takes aim at "snooty" indies, Condemns Call of Duty bashing - Polidicks

half of the people in this thread didn't read anything except the tittle he wasn't condemning innovation you childeren, he was condemning the attitude that some people who see themselves as innovative have.

but reading is hard

rate me dumb I get what he means now.

[QUOTE=UnidentifiedFlyingTard;31235182]Am I reading this wrong or did Carmack just pretty much say innovation is bad? are you sure this isn't Kotick?[/QUOTE] [img]http://cdn.nexternal.com/rocksolid/images/BobBooksPreReading.jpg[/img]

Indie games ain't even that great a lot of them are pretty terrible.

the only "indie" game I've enjoyed is gish

[QUOTE=Sanius;31235380]the only "indie" game I've enjoyed is gish[/QUOTE] What about Killing Floor or the Valve games?

no

Valve isn't really indie

[quote]no [/quote] Man you've gotta be kidding me. [QUOTE=Wootman;31235639]Valve isn't really indie[/QUOTE] They publish and develop their own games, which makes them indie.

EA publishes a lot of Valve's games.

[QUOTE=Wootman;31235765]EA publishes a lot of Valve's games.[/QUOTE] L4D, L4D2, Portal 2 were all self-published. EA just acted as a distributor; mostly for the console versions. Valve didn't have to report to EA at the end of the day.

it makes no sense to refer to a company as large as valve as "indie"

[QUOTE=Sanius;31235944]it makes no sense to refer to a company as large as valve as "indie"[/QUOTE] Unless the company is self-publishing. Which it is. Which is what indie means.

[QUOTE=Reimu;31235606]What about Killing Floor or the Valve games?[/QUOTE] valve's not indie, not by a long shot, indie isn't the same as independent

So something being indie, which is short for "independent," isn't the same as something being independent? You lost me there.

this argument is dumb

[quote] "So I do get pretty down on people that - you see some of the indie developers that really take a snooty attitude about this. It's almost as if it's popular, it's not good. And that's just not true." [/quote] Indie devs lately have been very successful for specific reasons, they offered fresh choices and experiences at highly competetive prices, in fact, they are something the bigger devs with their publisher umbrellas should really envy. The only reason that indie devs would look down on the popular is because it's all the same, change is past its due date.

"I can't win this" Sanius, 2011

[QUOTE=Reimu;31235973]Unless the company is self-publishing. Which it is. Which is what indie means.[/QUOTE] Bethesda publishes their own games. They publish id's games too. They aren't indie either. Even EA develops their own games and publishes them.

Ugh, this is totally ironic because I made the same exact point a week ago and everyone claimed you had to be self-publishing to be indie and I said you didn't have to. Now it's vice-vesra :v:.

That's it. Fuck iD, fuck Rage. I'm not buying this game because of those two cheeks against his mouth known as Carmack's buttface. [editline]20th July 2011[/editline] [QUOTE=Reimu;31236678]Ugh, this is totally ironic because I made the same exact point a week ago and everyone claimed you had to be self-publishing to be indie and I said you didn't have to. Now it's vice-vesra :v:.[/QUOTE] If you want the perfect ideal of what indie is. Introversion.

Being a genius does not make you immune to being dead wrong.

Valve is indie? Dude, what

I don't understand why everyone compares BF3 to MW3 and calls it a ''COD-killer'', because if BF3 is how you want it then it is nothing similiar to Call of Duty? People saying BF3 is a COD-killer basically says BF3 wont be what they expect from the game.

[QUOTE=klawneed;31237416]I don't understand why everyone compares BF3 to MW3 and calls it a ''COD-killer'', because if BF3 is how you want it then it is nothing similiar to Call of Duty? People saying BF3 is a COD-killer basically says BF3 wont be what they expect from the game.[/QUOTE] Remember the terms: "Mario-killer"? "Quake-killer"?

[QUOTE=PunchedInFac;31237503]Remember the terms: "Mario-killer"? "Quake-killer"?[/QUOTE] No, i do not.

[QUOTE=Reimu;31236070]So something being indie, which is short for "independent," isn't the same as something being independent? You lost me there.[/QUOTE] indie is short for small teams that make their dues by smaller games which rely more on word-of-mouth than commercial publishing valve is a very large company that distributes their games using commercial publishing means, nothing close to what we call indie

indie means independent to the same degree that fag means cigarette

I don't see why you guys have a problem naming big companies as indie, indie means independent. Just because Valve is big and well known doesn't mean they aren't indie, they publish and fund their own games from sales of past games, they are completely independent. Treyarch and Infinity Ward and DICE on the other hand aren't independent as EA/Activision fund and advertise their games. Just because your early games were very successful which gets you really well known and a lot of money to be able to advertise on TV and get a lot more employees doesn't mean you suddenly become not independent anymore. Yes the game industry associates the term indie with small dev teams who make and sell 2d games, but it doesn't mean it's exactly right. You can still be famous and make tons of money being an indie, you don't have to be starving.