So you played Rust for over 500 hours but couldn't support the developer with the few dollars the game costs? Can't say I feel any sympathy for you and your cheating brother, I'm sorry.
[QUOTE=larsd;49564980]So you played Rust for over 500 hours but couldn't support the developer with the few dollars the game costs? Can't say I feel any sympathy for you and your cheating brother, I'm sorry.[/QUOTE]
Not my brother. Never asked you for your sympathy, I just want an official FP statement about this matter. I don't feel sympathy towards cheaters aswell. I wanna support this game and buy it as my own, but in a fair way, I don't want to make a new steam. Please consider reading what's actually happening to me. I appreciate that.
At the end of the day, it's whoever owns the account's responsibility to ensure that anybody family sharing doesn't hack. If you hack while sharing somebody else's game it's between you and that person to reimburse them, not Garry/EAC.
You shouldn't have betrayed their trust by hacking with their copy of the game.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49564806]Thats exactly my point. I don't want to make a new account if I didnt do anything wrong. Why should I be punished? I value my steam and my friends. Im just waiting on Facepunch comments here to see if this is how they treat their player base.[/QUOTE]
They have to cover their bases though. Even if you say you wouldn't use your account as a way for the hacker to get around the ban, there are plenty of people who would. The only way for them to protect against it is to ban all accounts associated with the hacked account.
[editline]19th January 2016[/editline]
[QUOTE=KillerLUA;49565156]At the end of the day, it's whoever owns the account's responsibility to ensure that anybody family sharing doesn't hack. If you hack while sharing somebody else's game it's between you and that person to reimburse them, not Garry/EAC.
You shouldn't have betrayed their trust by hacking with their copy of the game.[/QUOTE]
How are people still missing what happened? OP didn't hack, you have the situation backwards.
You're responsible for your account and who you link it to via family sharing, OP. It sucks that you got burned, but you are that unfortunate one-in-a-thousand case of an innocent getting burned to close a loophole Valve created that was being [I]massively[/I] abused.
Programs aren't able to read minds, they just match conditions and actions. Unfortunately for you, this action was to EAC ban a cheater and a suspected evasion alt sharing the game on family share.
Note: I am not a Rust dev or a mod, don't overestimate my username colour.
[QUOTE=Crunchmeister;49557524]So.... let's look at this a slightly different way.
You regularly get a ride to work every day for free with someone. That person gets caught driving drunk and loses his license. But YOU didn't do anything. However, because of this, you now don't have a FREE ride to work every day. You think it's now unfair that you're being punished by no longer having a free ride to work so you're now begging the courts to have his license reinstated ONLY so he can drive you to work, because you're done nothing wrong.
Seriously? This sounds reasonable to you? Because that's what you're asking.
The real question here is: if you like Rust enough to have put 80 hours into it and be here asking for a ban appeal, how about you just BUY IT so you can play it all you want without having to rely on someone else's family-shared copy?[/QUOTE]
This is a flawed analogy because in your analogy the person who can't get a free ride anymore can just get a driver license himself and then drive around no problem.
So it should be that OP can buy Rust and play himself rather than borrowing.
In this case however OP cannot buy Rust on his account and play it, he needs to have a separate account to be able to do so but then he won't have his friends on that account, his other games, etc. etc. it's a hassle.
In addition his profile is now marked that he has a game ban which he didn't deserve and it's not like the guy who got a free ride in your analogy got a stamp on his head that says "he got free rides from a drunk driver" for the rest of his life
I'm torn on family sharing. It's a legitimate option for actual family members/ controlling what games parent's kids play, but then people turn around and abuse it. Hackers abuse it to avoid their main account being banned. Friends share it to avoid paying for games. I think the negatives outweigh the positives.
You received 500 hours of playtime you didn't pay for. Don't bitch. You should have bought your own copy and supported the developers long ago instead of being a mooch.
[QUOTE=Falxhor;49565396]This is a flawed analogy because in your analogy the person who can't get a free ride anymore can just get a driver license himself and then drive around no problem.
So it should be that OP can buy Rust and play himself rather than borrowing.
In this case however OP cannot buy Rust on his account and play it, he needs to have a separate account to be able to do so but then he won't have his friends on that account, his other games, etc. etc. it's a hassle.
In addition his profile is now marked that he has a game ban which he didn't deserve and it's not like the guy who got a free ride in your analogy got a stamp on his head that says "he got free rides from a drunk driver" for the rest of his life[/QUOTE]
I understand your point, but when you choose to family share, you bear some responsibility on who you associate with. Ultimately you're responsible for your own account and if you associate with hackers, you should bear some consequences.
Since we're using analogies, I'll go with this one: You have a group of friends. One of them steals a bike. You're unaware it's stolen. He gives it to you as a gift. You then decide to pawn it. When doing so, it's flagged as stolen. You get in trouble for possessing stolen property. Under the law, you have a requirement of using due diligence to verify if an item in your possession is stolen before pawning/selling it.
Never share Steam accounts or games! btw!?
Your Fault no one else's ,your friend or family is the blame Here!
Done ! And Over and Out! Get new account!
Some people seem to completely miss the point...
Here's some facts (we assume OP is in good faith and is not lying here) :
- OP does NOT own Rust
- OP is banned on a game he does not own (!?)
- OP's brother does own Rust
Now OF COURSE OP should not be able to play Rust with his brother's Rust since his brother is banned. Now : Why should OP make a new steam account to buy Rust instead of just buying Rust on his account? Isn't the punishment for cheating to have to buy the game again? If so then I don't see any reasons for OP to be banned. I would even be inclined to allow people to re-buy the game on their banned accounts to lift the ban (keep the ban mark though).
I guess the lesson here is that if you get fucked you can get STDs but you can also get STDs if you fuck someone. Receiving family-shared games on your account makes it vulnerable to bans.
My opinion : If a borrower's account gets banned then ban the lender, if a lender gets banned then ONLY ban borrowers if they do own the game already, if they don't LET THEM BUY IT.
[QUOTE=paca0502;49565185]
How are people still missing what happened? OP didn't hack, you have the situation backwards.[/QUOTE]
I didn't imply anything either way, in the OP's case where he shared the game with a family member, it's still his responsibility to make sure whoever he shares the game with doesn't betray his trust.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49564686]Any banned game on the main account automatically revokes the rights to access that game in any other account.
[B]There is no ban evading if the main account gets banned. Steam has this done automatically, there is no workaround.[/B] This is done so that only the owner (cheater) gets punished, and it can't be used as an exploit (the other way around, sure, it can).
You are all missing the point. I had that game shared to me, I didn't own it, and now I can't. Steam banned the owner, revoked my rights to use it, then EAC banned me, just because. Never once hacked on my account, EAC can check this, easily.[/QUOTE]
If getting game banned in a game auto-revokes it from Steam family share I see your point, but I don't understand why the shared account would have also been banned unless it was caught with cheats being run on it also.
I was under the impression the bans would only propagate to accounts also cheating rather than simply banning every account Rust is family shared to. That doesn't seem right at all so there must be something more to this.
I guess all you can do is hope an EAC employee responds.
probably the better approach would be for a game that the owner is banned in to no longer be able to be shared, but that's steam, not EAC who have to make that change. EAC are just doing what they can to close a shitty loophole made by steam; not sure there is a better way to deal with it other than for facepunch to disable family share for rust altogether.
[QUOTE=Cushie;49570057]If getting game banned in a game auto-revokes it from Steam family share I see your point, but I don't understand why the shared account would have also been banned unless it was caught with cheats being run on it also.
I was under the impression the bans would only propagate to accounts also cheating rather than simply banning every account Rust is family shared to. That doesn't seem right at all so there must be something more to this.
I guess all you can do is hope an EAC employee responds.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I'm also hoping they respond to this to make things clear.
[QUOTE]probably the better approach would be for a game that the owner is banned in to no longer be able to be shared, but that's steam, not EAC who have to make that change. EAC are just doing what they can to close a shitty loophole made by steam; not sure there is a better way to deal with it other than for facepunch to disable family share for rust altogether.[/QUOTE]
Steam already does this, automatically.
[QUOTE=KillerLUA;49569555]I didn't imply anything either way, in the OP's case where he shared the game with a family member, it's still his responsibility to make sure whoever he shares the game with doesn't betray his trust.[/QUOTE]
But the OP didn't share a game with a family member. A family member shared with him. That's the point I was saying you were missing.
[url]https://twitter.com/utilitron/status/689500465323577344[/url]
[QUOTE]@TeddyEAC Interesting question about family share and EAC bans [url]https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1502029[/url] … Can you look into it for him?[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]@utilitron The ban is permanent, sorry.
[/QUOTE]
Being banned for this is unfair on so many levels...
Do they even have legal grounds for this? I'm considering consulting a lawyer, since there's no evidence my account cheated and I'm being held responsible as the owner that shared to me (not from me) cheated without my consent or knowledge.
When he shared to me, I never agreed to any EULA/TOS like the owner did.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49570812]Steam already does this, automatically.[/QUOTE]
i mean that be the [B]only[/B] thing that affects the secondary accounts; that they cannot play the game, but that the ban does not flow down to them.
that said, you need to ban the primary account to prevent cheating on throwaway secondary accounts so it's a double edged sword. i think the better solution is simply to remove family share entirely. using games for free is too dangerous.
as for legal grounds, you agreed to the eula/tos by opening the game, not by him giving you access. there is no financial damages, and you would need to prove that the other account wasn't yours. i think it's pretty unlikely you can force them to reinstate your ability to play rust for free by borrowing it from a player found to be cheating. but it's possible that EAC might give you a chance. that said, i'm sure in this case they would watch you like a hawk and reban if you did indeed cheat.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49574335]When he shared to me, I never agreed to any EULA/TOS like the owner did.[/QUOTE]
Actually, with the Family Sharing feature, you [I]do[/I] agree to any EULA/TOS that are provided for the game. You may not have directly purchased it, but by agreeing to share the game (either as the sharer/owner or the sharee/sharing recipient) and playing it on your account, you are legally binding yourself to the same EULA/TOS that the owner has.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49574335]Do they even have legal grounds for this? I'm considering consulting a lawyer, since there's no evidence my account cheated and I'm being held responsible as the owner that shared to me (not from me) cheated without my consent or knowledge.
When he shared to me, I never agreed to any EULA/TOS like the owner did.[/QUOTE]
What exactly do you think a lawyer is going to do for you over a $20 video game? One that you never purchased to begin with. One that you can purchase now, simply on a different Steam account.
Well issuing "family members" on your account is the account owners responsibility.
Otherwise, hackers would just make another family member whenever they get banned and come back with no consequenses.
That is why the OWNER of the account is called just that. An owner.
It's the same if you would lend out your car to your friend. It is YOUR responsibility to ask for a drivers license and if you don't YOU are held responsible for whatever happens with that car.
Unless you do what you're doing now, claiming someone has "stolen" your car so to speak... then you should appeal. Write whoever VAC banned you and demand proof.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49574335]Do they even have legal grounds for this? I'm considering consulting a lawyer, since there's no evidence my account cheated and I'm being held responsible as the owner that shared to me (not from me) cheated without my consent or knowledge.
When he shared to me, I never agreed to any EULA/TOS like the owner did.[/QUOTE]
Now you are starting to annoy me. Consulting a lawyer because you are banned from a game you played for 500 hours but couldn't pay 20 dollars for? Get a life, man. Stop crying, move on and start paying for the games you play.
Family sharing is a very generous offer and people like you will only have it removed, permanently.
[QUOTE=hansleon;49574335]Do they even have legal grounds for this? I'm considering consulting a lawyer, since there's no evidence my account cheated and I'm being held responsible as the owner that shared to me (not from me) cheated without my consent or knowledge.
When he shared to me, I never agreed to any EULA/TOS like the owner did.[/QUOTE]
I wish FP would sue you for playing their game for 500 hours without paying a single cent. Instead of being thankful for the incredibly generous offer provided by Steam and agreed to by FP, you're bitching that you're VAC banned because you associated with a cheater.
In the future, know who you associate with. Don't associate with cheaters while sharing accounts.
Edit: That's still taking you at your word. I'm not even convinced you weren't the cheater. I'm just giving you the benefit of the doubt and taking your story at face value.
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