Blueprints on the steam store? A bad idea or the Baddest idea? - Rust

I'll just leave this here: [url]http://www.reddit.com/r/playrust/comments/2jle2z/so_do_you_like_the_steam_inventory_idea_or_not/[/url]

[QUOTE=TheQuagmire;46267796]Shaming tactics? it's 3 cents.. you sell one card that's valued 25 cents.. and your rich.. complaining over 3 cents is just... frankly sad.[/QUOTE] You are a complete, utter, weapon's grade moron. I've already said that the reason I don't like it is a hate pay-to-skip-grinding stuff. Get the fuck over yourself, yes everyone can afford 3p, woo big man you. That has fuck all to do with why this isn't liked. I hate repeating myself, but you seem stupid enough to warrant it, just this once.

[QUOTE=withnail;46267839]You are a complete, utter, weapon's grade moron. I've already said that the reason I don't like it is a hate pay-to-skip-grinding stuff. Get the fuck over yourself, yes everyone can afford 3p, woo big man you. That has fuck all to do with why this isn't liked. I hate repeating myself, but you seem stupid enough to warrant it, just this once.[/QUOTE] Thanks, i was looking for a chance to use the "zing" rating

[QUOTE=withnail;46267839]You are a complete, utter, weapon's grade moron. I've already said that the reason I don't like it is a hate pay-to-skip-grinding stuff. Get the fuck over yourself, yes everyone can afford 3p, woo big man you. That has fuck all to do with why this isn't liked. I hate repeating myself, but you seem stupid enough to warrant it, just this once.[/QUOTE] Pay to skip for 3 pennies.. Bravo sir. Your argument is a class act. Instead of QQing over matter's that haven't been entirely laid down. Like what [b]EXACTLY[/b] will be marketable/trade-able first before you have a heart attack fighting over nothing of great importance.

[QUOTE=TheQuagmire;46267885]3 pennies.[/QUOTE] Let it go. We know you have 3 pennies. Hell, you might even have 5. Nobody gives a fuck.

[QUOTE=TheQuagmire;46267885]Pay to skip for 3 pennies.. Bravo sir. Your argument is a class act. Instead of QQing over matter's that haven't been entirely laid down. Like what [b]EXACTLY[/b] will be marketable/trade-able first before you have a heart attack fighting over nothing of great importance.[/QUOTE] I don't believe that waiting to know [b]EXACTLY[/b] what will be marketable is not as important as as you think. The original devblog inferred that Weapon blue prints (IE the most valuable items in the game) would be transferable over the marketplace. The post was then changed to use Clothing blue prints as an example. This was a deliberate change due most likely to the shit storm brewing here on the forums as well as elsewhere in the rust community. If someone told you they were gonna lay you down and then drop a deuce on your chest, would you wait until you saw with your own eyes what kinda turd they were getting ready to pinch off before you raised any objections? Like will it have corn in it? Is it mostly solid or might I get a little brown mist at the end? Of course not. I don't want blueprints being sold in Rust just like you shouldn't want someone taking a shit on you.

[QUOTE=y0himba;46267810]I'll just leave this here: [url]http://www.reddit.com/r/playrust/comments/2jle2z/so_do_you_like_the_steam_inventory_idea_or_not/[/url][/QUOTE] Thx man, this clears things up a little.

Adding my two cents, this is a TERRIBLE idea. I hope they scrap it and NEVER use anything like it. What the heck is Garry thinking?

[QUOTE=y0himba;46267810]I'll just leave this here: [url]http://www.reddit.com/r/playrust/comments/2jle2z/so_do_you_like_the_steam_inventory_idea_or_not/[/url][/QUOTE] This is what I understood (correct me if I am wrong): [B] Server blueprint database (in game) ---> Global blueprint database (steam)[/B] Bourlap trousers ---> Bourlap trousers + Jeans + baggy + corduroys +..+ cosmetic trousers blueprint When you get the drop of the server blueprint you then get the global blueprint for that item along with all the others 30 cloth cost trousers in the game. The great thing here is that crafting knowledge can be run by a steam community market so every time you teach somebody something (giving him a card) you are losing part of your knowledge (you have a limited amount of cards). There will be a problem in the amount of knowledge in the market: being a virtual game, with infinite number of blueprints, we are gonna crack the system by overflowing offert. It could be fun if the amount of usual drop blueprints will turn really cheap and common blueprints into free blueprints. That way the amount of gameplay learning time spent by the community will become into culturize the newmans of Rust. Here is what I thought: [B] Server blueprint database (in game) ---> Global blueprint database (steam)[/B] 10 Ideas ---> 1 researcher card Bourlap trousers ---> Bourlap trousers Jeans prototype <--- Bourlap trousers + Researcher card= Pants (choose one available) Prototype Jeans prototype + Jeans! (crafted or found object) + research table=Jeans ---> Jeans Eoka pistol --> Eoka pistol Revolver prototype <-- Eoka pistol + Researcher card= Gun (choose one available) Prototype Revolver prototype + Revolver!(crafted or found object) + research table=Revolver ---> Revolver Prototypes are not finished items so you cannot use them but you can craft them if you have the materials, randomly you can craft a working one and then you can learn the server and global blueprint. Prototype blueprints should follow a researcher´s tree of unlocking availability, your goal as a rust steam card player is to get all unlocked... Researcher cards, collected by ingame gathering, will go straightly to your global card database (you can not sell this ones). They are one time use cards that get consume at researching, same as the blueprints in which you are basing your research. Researcher cards are suppose to be ideas, old ideas that you can find at bookpiles and bookshelves at remnants and such but I think there should also be new ideas which are spontaneously drop to the ground by your character from time to time, like in 50 hours or so your character drops enough amount of new ideas that you can complete all the research tree. You can also steal other peoples new ideas if you are fast enough to take them from the ground before they do. Edited: ---> Saving (action in game: mediation, the player needs to be out of combat with all stats at green). <--- Creating (action in game:survive)

Read the reddit as well. If the problem being solved is specifically for wipes, may I point to an unoriginal idea in the suggestions thread I gave of allowing networks of servers that players could row boats to another. They all just show as far off distance islands from the one you are on. Its of course based on the minecraft server portal. Linky if interested. [url]http://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1423610&p=46118616&viewfull=1#post46118616[/url] Now to the harsh critic. Here is something in escapable to consider. Beyond trading, money, or any propositions of unfair advantages. [u]It's bad game design. [/u] Why? The short answer has been alluded with the global blueprint breaking immersion. The further key point is its inconsistent. First, you only have this one particular portion of your identity being allowed across servers. Second, servers will not always allow you to use these global variation(s). It would be more consistent if all aspects of a player was cross server such as DayZ or Nether. I'm not saying these are good design either, in fact as I mentioned you still have the immersion breaking in Nether with its global inventory, but at least these both present a consistent rule system to the player. I have said it before, but something like this has to be part of the original design to flow well. Its changing a core mechanic of the game which needs then all other mechanics to be altered so it becomes a cohesive whole. At least at this point as I hopefully showed above we now have the quandry of inconsistency.

some people are so stupid

Shit, I thought I was editing and I was replying. Sorry. I will take this post and post this here. For people who want to start full white over again in a private server: [B]Server blueprint database (in game) ---> Auxiliar server blueprint database (server) ---> Global blueprint database (steam)[/B] The auxiliar database emulates the global database but it is completely blank and it can prevent the player to use the blueprints he knows from the global database or get new blueprints into steam (this database gets wipe with the server).

i might start by quoting the redit post from garry that yOhimba provided the link to. [QUOTE]"The idea was to have two tiers of blueprints. A server, and global. The server list would start off with things you could always craft. Stuff like a hammer, campfire etc - bootstrap stuff. The global (steam dropped) stuff would be variants of those items with jiggled attributes. So a pair of burlap trousers would be a server blueprint.. and a pair of jeans would be a global blueprint. The jeans wouldn't offer any significant advantage - it'd be mostly cosmetic. The missing piece I didn't explain is what we haven't got fully figured out yet. You'd need to have the server blueprint to be able to build the global blueprint variant. I didn't mention this because I was planning on everyone having those blueprints by default at first (which is how it is right now)."[/QUOTE] so i interpret that as us starting with all the basics, ie shotgun, bolty, kevlar etc. the vanilla blueprints. and then we find/earn/trade/sell the global variants of these items. that don't especially affect gameplay, since they are extras, and mostly re-skins. even if they are actual weopons etc, they would be balanced to be equivalent in resource costs/power to vanilla gear by the devs. so what advantages are we talking about? everyone has the vanilla(server) blueprints from scratch. bonus(global) blueprints will practically just be flavors of vanilla gear, and balanced by the team to prevent advantages going to p2p players. and they will be available to everyone, as i understand it. affordable, found and possible to trade. personally i trust them not to fuck us. they haven't yet.

[QUOTE=mrknifey;46269064]personally i trust them not to fuck us. they haven't yet.[/QUOTE] I am not convinced yet about this but am keeping an open mind, and see if it works. As i have said in other threads about this i can see both sides of this good points and bad. And call me a fan boy but i trust Garry and the rest of the RUST dev team to make the best game they can.

[QUOTE=kulan;46269290]I am not convinced yet about this but am keeping an open mind, and see if it works. As i have said in other threads about this i can see both sides of this good points and bad. And call me a fan boy but i trust Garry and the rest of the RUST dev team to make the best game they can.[/QUOTE] fan boy :zoid: They are doing great, it will be playable, sure.

I admire gary for acknowledging the criticism and addressing it. Its unfortunate he has to work around perceptions generated largely by other companies and their business practices. I think its obvious he is not a businessman first, which is refreshing. I still think he should do what he thinks is best and not to try to appease everyone on the internet, that's a fools errand. With that said, he should be commended for at least acknowledging peoples concerns.

If the tradable blueprints were JUST 100% COSMETIC (skins) and have no special attributes I could probably tolerate it, but only as reskins of items you already found the blueprints for in-game (not being able to acquire and use/craft an item/blueprint from the store without having found the original item blueprint in the game first). Still wouldn’t like it much but I could live with it because this is a purely subjective opinion of mine and reskins of existing (already found) items wouldn’t affect gameplay

I just read about the selling blueprints like trading cards. Awful idea.

it will ruined the game if blueprints are on the steam store. Now a noob with money will c4 my house? no fucking way!

[QUOTE=Reidfira;46271635]it will ruined the game if blueprints are on the steam store. Now a noob with money will c4 my house? no fucking way![/QUOTE] HE CANT FUCKING BUY THE SUPPLIES this is why people are fucking stupid they dont realise what the idea is, its awesome

best idea ever go on garry

[QUOTE=Unemphatic;46271708]HE CANT FUCKING BUY THE SUPPLIES this is why people are fucking stupid they dont realise what the idea is, its awesome[/QUOTE] Doesn’t matter you can’t buy the supplies, you can buy the blueprints without having to play a single minute of the game, the whole blueprint finding thing is 50% of the effort and part of the fun in the game. BAD IDEA

[QUOTE=pachorradas;46271978]Doesn’t matter you can’t buy the supplies, you can buy the blueprints without having to play a single minute of the game, the whole blueprint finding thing is 50% of the effort and part of the fun in the game. BAD IDEA[/QUOTE] not if the blue prints require the base weapon first. It's not a blueprint that takes raw materials to make x super duper weapon of mass uberness. You still need a bolt action rifle... than the materials to even craft it. So how would this be an issue? It's like addon blueprints. They aren't essential.

[QUOTE=TheQuagmire;46272558]not if the blue prints require the base weapon first. It's not a blueprint that takes raw materials to make x super duper weapon of mass uberness. You still need a bolt action rifle... than the materials to even craft it. So how would this be an issue? It's like addon blueprints. They aren't essential.[/QUOTE] Still, they said you will be able to find all the blueprints in the game so, even if they are add-on, you are still taking a shortcut by buying them as opposed to finding them, my point is still valid.

[QUOTE=pachorradas;46273061]Still, they said you will be able to find all the blueprints in the game so, even if they are add-on, you are still taking a shortcut by buying them as opposed to finding them, my point is still valid.[/QUOTE] You aren't buying them directly from FP though. You are trading/steam market what other player's have found. It's not a 100% guarantee there will be a blueprint you want to get. So you still have to earn it regardless.

"The intention isn’t for us to sell blueprints to you,.." The way he said this leaves Garry the option to sell DLC´s at a later stage. If he truly had no intensions to make money with DLC´s he would have worded it more clearly and ruled out and DLC´s in the future.

[QUOTE=spooner777;46274111]"The intention isn’t for us to sell blueprints to you,.." The way he said this leaves Garry the option to sell DLC´s at a later stage. If he truly had no intensions to make money with DLC´s he would have worded it more clearly and ruled out and DLC´s in the future.[/QUOTE] No he shouldn't, as that's a good way to shoehorn your game development and come off as a hypocrite down the line if they decide to change the direction of the game.

I saw a post on the reddit thread about this that got me thinking. [quote=reddit] > Having to use the Steam overlay to interact with players is immersion breaking. Agree strongly here, maybe Garry can use the Steam API to make all of it happen in game.[/quote] If this happens, it will be great. I am going to get an m4 and a bolt action and start holding up nakeds. "STOP RIGHT THERE! Show me your steam inventory. Ahhh, I see you've got a giftable copy of Buttwars - hand it over and I'll let you live."

THIS WAS THERE PLAN FROM THE START! [t]http://i.imgur.com/OpFXzPC.jpg[/t]

[QUOTE=pachorradas;46273061]Still, they said you will be able to find all the blueprints in the game so, even if they are add-on, you are still taking a shortcut by buying them as opposed to finding them, my point is still valid.[/QUOTE] Wrong, [b]you still have to find the base blueprint.[/b] Did you even read the quote above from Garry on reddit? Specifically this part: [quote] You'd need to have the server blueprint to be able to build the global blueprint variant. I didn't mention this because I was planning on everyone having those blueprints by default at first (which is how it is right now)." [/quote] Basically, what this means is let's say you have the "Clown Shoes" item in your steam inventory. This would require the base blueprint "Burlap Shoes" (or whatever) in the server. So, in order to be able to craft your "Clown Shoes" - you first have to [b]find the burlap shoes blueprint in the server you play on[/b] before you can craft your "Clown Shoes". This is just a cosmetics thing. You can basically skin the items you can craft, in a way. You still need the original, base blueprint in the server you're playing on before you can craft the "reskin". This doesn't give any advantages. Same stats as the original "Burlap Shoes", it's just a reskin. That's it. I don't see what's so wrong about this. Sounds awesome to me. How is this bad if it's just cosmetics, seriously?