WEAPONS, WHY!? - Rust - Facepunch Forum

Dear developers, Why are there weapons in the game like shotguns, rifles, pistols, C4's and grenades etc.? It makes no sense to me, it makes the 'end game' (which is reached in about 1 hour max. BTW) meaningless in my eyes. It makes raiding and PvP too easy and boring. Rust states to be a "SURVIVAL" game, but Facepunch better picture Rust as a first person shooter. The game would be way more awesome when the developers would delete the overpowered 'high-tech' weapons and keep the standard weapons like the spear and bow with arrows. Also, the game, since it's based on survival, should be more hardcore and be more focused on survival in nature. This could be reached when the game is more based on terraforming, building and co-operating. Anyway, my main issue with the game are the overpowered weapons. Don't get me wrong, I already got the game since the first release of Rust Legacy and I loved it ever since, and still. But Facepunch throws away so much potential with this game.

I do not know why, but I am beginning to think the same way.

Rust should be renamed to Counter Strike "Survival"

Server mods. They exist for this exact reason. And as soon as facepunch gets around to adding in a block button, I'll be starting up on the first primitive server I find.

Exactly, This game should be survival w/o M249s, Aks, C4, choppers, tactical gear, etc. All weapons should be primitive like eoka, water pipe, clubs, knives, swords, machetes. No building grades above stone with maybe sheet metal shutters. It needs to be a grind for survival and that would make for more clans/friends having to band together for survival and as well make those groups more loyal to one another as allies depending on each other. The only modded server should be Battle Royale under the same above ground rules.

This post and the comments on it literally gave me cancer. There are so many things wrong with what's been stated in this post i don't even know where to start *slaps forehead*

[QUOTE=sonaqua;49598490]Rust should be renamed to Counter Strike "Survival"[/QUOTE] Completely agree. The Counter Strike aspect of the game is a disgrace.

[QUOTE=Tonyiih;49597766]Dear developers, Why are there weapons in the game like shotguns, rifles, pistols, C4's and grenades etc.? It makes no sense to me, it makes the '[B]end game[/B]' (which is reached in about 1 hour max. BTW) meaningless in my eyes. It makes raiding and [B]PvP too easy and boring[/B]. Rust states to be a "SURVIVAL" game, but Facepunch better picture Rust as a first person shooter. The game would be way more awesome when the developers would delete the overpowered 'high-tech' weapons and keep the standard weapons like the [B]spear and bow with arrows[/B]. Also, the game, since it's based on survival, should be more hardcore and be more focused on survival in nature. This could be reached when the game is more based on terraforming, building and co-operating. Anyway, my main issue with the game are the overpowered weapons. Don't get me wrong, I already got the game since the first release of Rust Legacy and I loved it ever since, and still. But Facepunch throws away so much potential with this game.[/QUOTE] I think raiding with stone-age-tools looks pretty boring. I dont want to be in the situation that i use a stonehatchet for 6 hours on a simple wall.. If you reach all endgame weapons too fast, then look for vanilla or official servers. I am quite sure, that it will take a little bit longer to be very well prepaired for raids. If you dont like pvp, then i would advise you pve servers or start playing lego ;) sincerly moikahl (sorry for my bad english, im german)

There are servers that are exactly like that, search for them.

I think guns should just be a whole lot harder to obtain, and very difficult to find blueprints for. The developers of Rust [B][U]will not[/U][/B] just throw out all of the guns of Rust because you don't like how easy it is to get them. They put countless hours of work into each gun, detailing them, and crafting them. I don't think the many developers who worked on those animations and models, who put in so much hard work into them, would like for all of that work to be for nothing.

If weapons crafting took longer, or crafting of weapons were removed it would add to the mid/long term aspect of the game.

[QUOTE=Tonyiih;49597766]Why are there weapons in the game like shotguns, rifles, pistols, C4's and grenades etc.? *snip* Don't get me wrong, I already got the game since the first release of Rust Legacy and I loved it ever since, and still. But Facepunch throws away so much potential with this game.[/QUOTE] did you actually play legacy though? because most of the primitive gear we have in the new version is actually absent from the old version, while the guns have always been a major part of it. i agree that they are perhaps too easily obtained. and i would be tempted to make most of the higher tier guns salvaged but not crafted. but all this is tweaking; removing them would be changing a massive element of the game that has been present since the start.

I'd love a modded server with only primitive weapons and 100-150 users. Especially now when a semi-automatic rifle can be obtained by crafting 1 hour into the game after starting with a rock and torch, if the player avoids death the first hour of playing and is effective. By the way, all the talk about "mid game" and "end game" etc. is funny now. When I start (on a vanilla server with 100-150 players) I can get a well hidden stone house 2x2 or similar with armored door, furnace, repair bench and semi-automatic rifle within 1 - 1 1/2 hour of playing after starting with a rock and a torch, if I don't run into the wrong people several times in a row. Then on it's mostly just adding to what I have until the next wipe and building more bases, even bigger ones without loot, because few people bother to raid the small bases. There's not really a lot of storytelling in the game now as it's to easy to establish.

[QUOTE=Samson0722;49601283]I think guns should just be a whole lot harder to obtain, and very difficult to find blueprints for. The developers of Rust [B][U]will not[/U][/B] just throw out all of the guns of Rust because you don't like how easy it is to get them. They put countless hours of work into each gun, detailing them, and crafting them. I don't think the many developers who worked on those animations and models, who put in so much hard work into them, would like for all of that work to be for nothing.[/QUOTE] When guns are harder to obtain then the game will be more and more unbalanced. Only large clans run 24/7 with ak and kill all the bow guys.

[QUOTE=larsd;49602391]I'd love a modded server with only primitive weapons and 100-150 users. [/QUOTE] It already exists. No guns (maybe Waterpipe and Eoka), no C4, no explosives, no sheet or armored metal, and... *drumroll*... KOS is forbidden. Yeaaah

Weapons RULE :D Don't delete those, and don't assume that the begin/mid game is useless either. The game is in alpha and so game elements will still be added. The way I understand it, is that the barrel/box blueprint grind, will be replaced/extended with a skilltree. Skilltrees means that not all weapons can be used or crafted right away and will thus extend the begin/mid game. Another thing that I assume will happen, is something like in WoW. There are low level and high level areas, low level players have no chance to survive in high level areas, and high level players have no possible gains in low level areas and this, plus pvp disabled towns, ballances that begin/mid/end gameplay. Now ofcourse Rust is no WoW, and Rustpvp no WoWpvp, but some barrelareas or radtowns can still be considered high level areas, and high level players have nothing to gain from traveling to nowhereland to raid twigwalled, wooden doored huts. Both high end and low end weapons are great, add nukes as well.. would be awesome.. building those nuclear facilities and defending them with massive clans :D and there would be no chance on earth that they would spend all those resources by dropping it on a twighouse :) High end + low end can be in perfect harmony.. just needs to become a little more streamlined, but to me it seems like the puzzlepieces are falling in place :)

[QUOTE=Lurd;49603055]It already exists. No guns (maybe Waterpipe and Eoka), no C4, no explosives, no sheet or armored metal, and... *drumroll*... KOS is forbidden. Yeaaah[/QUOTE] What's it called? No KOS is a silly rule, though. [editline]25th January 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=buttslap;49603181]Weapons RULE :D Don't delete those, and don't assume that the begin/mid game is useless either. The game is in alpha and so game elements will still be added. The way I understand it, is that the barrel/box blueprint grind, will be replaced/extended with a skilltree. Skilltrees means that not all weapons can be used or crafted right away and will thus extend the begin/mid game. Another thing that I assume will happen, is something like in WoW. There are low level and high level areas, low level players have no chance to survive in high level areas, and high level players have no possible gains in low level areas and this, plus pvp disabled towns, ballances that begin/mid/end gameplay. Now ofcourse Rust is no WoW, and Rustpvp no WoWpvp, but some barrelareas or radtowns can still be considered high level areas, and high level players have nothing to gain from traveling to nowhereland to raid twigwalled, wooden doored huts. Both high end and low end weapons are great, add nukes as well.. would be awesome.. building those nuclear facilities and defending them with massive clans :D and there would be no chance on earth that they would spend all those resources by dropping it on a twighouse :) High end + low end can be in perfect harmony.. just needs to become a little more streamlined, but to me it seems like the puzzlepieces are falling in place :)[/QUOTE] This is probably the worst wishlist for the future of Rust I've ever seen. High level areas goes against everything the game Rust is, and nukes... come on.

Why is that. Wouldn't it be correct to describe an area with for example a larger and agressive clan, that has higher tier weapons then you and your buddies, as a 'high level area'?

[QUOTE=larsd;49603200]What's it called? No KOS is a silly rule, though. [/QUOTE] They have kos and raiding only allowed on weekends or something like that.

well may you need try other games. Rust is about survive, but is after our on tech level, and all guns are actually really normal. maybe need more tiers and better upgrade craft tier. wood workbench make stone tools, stone workbench make firsts metal tools, simple metal workbench make medium metal tools, and beyong with some kind of this i agree but not remove the craft factor or even the entire weapon system. When you are on the top, like humans. Just other humans are to dangerous to us. If u Know how to farm food and water, the rest is being better ways to do it, and survive from other humans trying to kill us.

I have only just started playing the game, but I read the original post and it has me scratching my head....how the heck do you get top tier guns 1hr into the game??? It has taken me hours just to hunt enough animal fat to make the fuel I need to build a furnace. (It's just not safe smelting on a public furnace!) I have been playing only on official servers, which is presumably the way the game was meant to be played. I can only assume the OP is playing on mod servers? That or I am really missing something?

[QUOTE=larsd;49603200]What's it called? No KOS is a silly rule, though.[/QUOTE] Rust would have sooo much potential if players stopped killing everybody they see. It is advertised as a survival game. I don't see how killing a harmless naked 100+ meters away is survival. I wish the devs implemented more features that forced players to collaborate and interact with each other instead of giving them more and more ways to turn the game into a shitty generic FPS. There's a US server (Dark Ages Medieval) who has 100-150 players on average. Can't play on it because of shitty ping. [QUOTE=larsd;49603200]This is probably the worst wishlist for the future of Rust I've ever seen. High level areas goes against everything the game Rust is, and nukes... come on.[/QUOTE] I kinda agree with the skilltree system. And you're saying that it goes against everything that the game is, but.. So is the XP system that's being worked on. I think it would make a nice addition, and it would bring balance. New players could craft rifles and explosives, albeit shitty and less cost-effective than "veterans", to defend themselves. I think one of the main reasons a lot of players stopped playing Rust is because they keep being killed as nakeds by geared players for absolutely no reason (what are the odds that a dude running with his dick out has anything valuable in his inventory?). If you gave newbs ways to defend themselves at the beginning, there would be less frustration and more players. I, for one, became bored with the game a few months ago. I love the game, but I hate the players. For example, I was playing on a server only to try the Gun Game mod. Between rounds I was randomly hitting barrels to find loot that could help other players (i had absolutely no use of it, i didn't plan on playing more than a few hours on the server), and I found a quarry (which is quite valuable on a vanilla server). I knocked on a door, asking the dude inside the house (small one) if he would like to have it. He came out, told me "yes", and I gave it to him. He thanked me, I left, and a few seconds later.. Boom, headshot with a bolt, from behind, by the dude I just helped. Rust players are horrible dicks, way more than on Legacy.

[QUOTE=Schock;49604046]how the heck do you get top tier guns 1hr into the game???[/QUOTE] Most servers are quite big, 100-250 ppl. Lots of players are part of a clan. Clans tend to share BP's with eachother. You can hit a barrel and get a c4 BP at the first barrel you see in the first minute of the game. (I've actually witnessed that). Airdrop? == + AK and goodies After you and your friends get the AK, you then setup base near a Dome, Airfield, Radtown or Satellite Dish and steal all blueprints from the naked guys unawarely grinding those areas for you. Add a tower when the Bolt is in, and all loots are yours :) (nobody said Rust was fair :P) [editline]25th January 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Lurd;49604082] I don't see how killing a harmless naked 100+ meters away is survival.[/QUOTE] Did he survive? And he might survive if he sits 100++ meters away, so he could prevent his seemingly unpreventable demise after having learned this lesson. [editline]25th January 2016[/editline] [QUOTE=Lurd;49604082] I wish the devs implemented more features that forced players to collaborate and interact with each other instead of giving them more and more ways to turn the game into a shitty generic FPS.[/QUOTE] You see, and Thats why being able to make a nuclear bomb would be awesome. It would require HUGE facilities and centrifuges and massive chimneys and such that would force players to collaborate and interact with eachother. Resources have to be gathered, the facilities have to be made, and protected, and the bomb has to be manufactured and everyone in the neighberhoud is aware of what you are doing and would either want to steal your materials, or prevent your group from building this bomb. Because it will be a threat to everyone in the neighberhoud, stimulating them to work together as well and to destroy your clans progress.

I actually agree with everything OP said EXCEPT the part about removing weapons. I think they should be [B]INCREDIBLY[/B] rare, and something that barely gets used; more-so because you can't find ammo and have only 1, not because you have 8 of them or because you ALREADY found something better. In an ideal situation, guns should be used less often than C4 is currently used. Everything 'above guns' in terms of estranged technological advancement (pump jacks and quarries, C4, sentry turrets?!) should be legendary status to get[[B]per wipe cycle[/B]], even for massive groups. I definitely enjoy the low tech stuff way more like the [U]bone club, bow, salvaged sword[/U], and the ability to throw that shit at people in a panic. It's way more interesting gameplay than point and click. [B]P.S.[/B] Once the leveling system is in place, and they add a fucking composite bow with different arrow types([I]wouldn't take that long[/I]) I guarantee people will prefer the CompBow to weapons simply for the stealth, ease of ammo, and consistency.

[QUOTE=buttslap;49604089] You see, and Thats why being able to make a nuclear bomb would be awesome. It would require HUGE facilities and centrifuges and massive chimneys and such that would force players to collaborate and interact with eachother. Resources have to be gathered, the facilities have to be made, and protected, and everyone in the neighberhoud is seeing what you are doing and would either want to steal your materials, or prevent your group from building this bomb. Because it will be a threat to everyone in the neighberhoud, stimulating them to work together as well and to destroy your clans progress.[/QUOTE] Let's agree on the "collaboration" part. But how would a nuclear bomb be a worthy implementation in the game? Most maps are 4000 size (~2km x 2km). Theoretically, the blast radius would pretty much wipe the whole map, killing everyone on it and destroying (at least partially) their houses. And then?

[QUOTE=Lurd;49604182]Let's agree on the "collaboration" part. But how would a nuclear bomb be a worthy implementation in the game? Most maps are 4000 size (~2km x 2km). Theoretically, the blast radius would pretty much wipe the whole map, killing everyone on it and destroying (at least partially) their houses. And then?[/QUOTE] well... smaller tactical nuclear bombs of course .. and then, I dunno, maybe it could convert housing and stuff into raw materials that could then be picked up from the ground in one massive looting frenzy :D *also, I think it was Elix, that claimed that maps required to be generated in order to be able to host a much bigger area in some type of cloud hosting configuration (not sure if that was serious though because that seems quite the large order to me)

Of course if you are already part of a clan you can benefit from the hours of collective gameplay they have put in, but as an individual just starting out, not knowing anyone, there is hours of gameplay just trying to survive. Even if you are lucky enough to find a c4 bp early on, good luck scraping together the mats you need to craft it before you take care of more pressing needs, like surviving. I agree that the weapons in the game don't ruin the game, it's how they are used. I guess once you've got all the gear and the big base it gets boring so all there is to do is snipe naked fresh spawns who have nothing but a rock. Those guys should keep in mind that if they want the game and community to thrive and grow they should cut the newbies a break and give them a chance to get started. I am sure more than a few players have given up the game in frustration!

[QUOTE=Schock;49604383]I agree that the weapons in the game don't ruin the game, it's how they are used. I guess once you've got all the gear and the big base it gets boring so all there is to do is snipe naked fresh spawns who have nothing but a rock. Those guys should keep in mind that if they want the game and community to thrive and grow they should cut the newbies a break and give them a chance to get started. I am sure more than a few players have given up the game in frustration![/QUOTE] Thats just weak. There are many valid reasons to be a lameass in Rust, like for example setting up your tower near a place of interest to harvest barrelhitting naked guys together with your friend(s). Rust is a game of thugs, so this is what you should expect. Besides, the first time you get sniped while hitting barrels at the airfield is nobodies fault but that of the shooter, the second time, its yours. Lamassness is proportional to your own lack of adaptability, the other guy does just what is effective. I usually start running away as soon as I see someone far in the distance, when I'm on a blueprint hunt.

LOL! Many valid reasons to be a lame-ass! Obviously there is that element of risk/reward that is part of the game. If you venture into an area with high value loot as a naked, you accept that you are competing with geared up players that also want that loot. What I am talking about is the lame-asses (your words!) That shoot a naked pounding on a tree with a rock so they can make a spear! I am also amazed at how many guys who are fresh spawns themselves, and attack other nakeds even if you tell them your friendly. It is hard enough to survive in the beginning, they should be only too happy to have an ally! Fortunately I have recently met a couple of like minded players....had to go to a Canadian server to find friendlies!

[QUOTE=Schock;49604626]What I am talking about is the lame-asses (your words!) That shoot a naked pounding on a tree with a rock so they can make a spear![/quote] Felines also play with their half dead pray before eventually killing them.. very lame.. but it's your responsibility to just dont get near them, like I said, at start, just avoid all human contact. [QUOTE=Schock;49604626] I am also amazed at how many guys who are fresh spawns themselves, and attack other nakeds even if you tell them your friendly. It is hard enough to survive in the beginning, they should be only too happy to have an ally![/quote] Survival means that you do that which works the best. If I want to attack you, and am able to convince you that I wont, I have a guarenteed first strike and a significant advantage.