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[QUOTE=iFail;45475082]I'm fully aware of this video, but I have a few doubts about the quality of the briefing and of the relevance of those questions. Very little of that briefing is actual evidence that the Ukrainians are responsible. [/quote] Soo by this logic you'd rather...
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[QUOTE=iFail;45474527]Yes. It's not hard to believe them, either. Their narrative is altogether simpler and easier to believe than the stuff that's been put out in opposition. The Russian media really blew it when they tried to claim it was shot down by a Ukrainian Su-25. ...
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[QUOTE=gudman;45474414]That makes sense, but why refer to evidence they can't release. Hoping people would take their word for it?[/QUOTE] They try to show support to Ukrainan goverment and go desperate enough to agree accounting on anything that in some way blames rebels.
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[QUOTE=Apache249;45474097]Uh let's wait and see?[/QUOTE] yeah, I just wish this was a far more common reaction rather then "omg i saw three tweets and audio on youtube, blame da rebels'. also, what about my question?
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I do hope world is going to finally snap out of "tweetbelievers" and try to atleast ask for some more official stated proof from those who oppose russian sources on case. And again, a question that still no one here asnwered for me - How will people react if it will be pr...
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Anyhow, here's some new info. black boxes arrived in britain under ICAO's watch, all secure and good [url]http://ria.ru/world/20140723/1017183845.html[/url] (translated article will be soon) And Russia handed over info from Defence ministry to EU commision. [url]http://en.r...
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[QUOTE=gudman;45468982]It might have been that Buk was initially "aimed" at Boeing in confusion. If rebels didn't know about MH17 being there, they could've mistakenly track it instead of Ukrainian UFO (we don't know exactly what jet it was, briefing only made their pick due t...
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[QUOTE=gudman;45468786]As far as this "another jet in the area" theory goes, I'd explain it like that: they don't really want to admit that their military jet was "hiding" near passenger airliner, in its "radar shadow", so to speak.[/QUOTE] but if that confirms somehow, wo...
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[QUOTE=gudman;45468741]Yeah, that's what I'm believing as well. Rebels probably knew about Ukrainian jet in the area (whatever it was), but didn't know about airliner. Fired the missile at the jet, and their radars (or Russian long-range airport radars from Rostov tracking the...
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[QUOTE=TheKingofBees;45468574]not sure why your link didn't work but here's a working version to the article [URL="http://www.wired.com/2014/07/sa-11-missiles-easy-to-use/"]http://www.wired.com/2014/07/sa-11-missiles-easy-to-use/[/URL][/QUOTE] That article is a bit bullshi...
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[QUOTE=gudman;45468569]Yeah, figured as well. Thought that maybe there's something out there that would tell more, guess that's unlikely.[/QUOTE] Google Earth had cloud mapping but i am really not sure if you can trust those
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[QUOTE=gudman;45468365]Well, not completely, but most of the stuff that matters - yeah, you could say that. Russia24 in my opinion is the more trustworthy source of official ones, because it doesn't release outright lies. It can avoid showing something that's there, or give a ...
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[QUOTE=gudman;45468251]Yeah that trail part seems interesting. I've heard a lot of "witnesses" on media here and there, claiming that they either saw "a plane going down", or "two planes, bigger one and smaller one near it"... but no one ever mentioned the smoke trail. Given t...
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[QUOTE=LVL FACTORY;45467973]This guy, a former Russian/Soviet S-200 operator:[/QUOTE] This is extremely informative(i never thought about buk trail thing myself) but could you please provide link to original text
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[QUOTE=Teddybeer;45465414][IMG]http://i.imgur.com/Chrrnos.jpg[/IMG] [url]https://twitter.com/barbarastarrcnn/status/491559153559932928/photo/1[/url][/QUOTE] I hope this is not the ''recon info'' white house promised to publish, cause I can edit map with colored lines al...
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[QUOTE=Buck.;45459285]Did they test for residue of explosives on the debris yet?[/QUOTE] There was literally no one except for OSCE on crashsite, and they were merely "observing situation". Where are all the ICAO and other flight experts? [editline]22nd July 2014[/editl...
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[QUOTE=Teddybeer;45459017][URL="http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/1d6a9ac2-10e3-11e4-b116-00144feabdc0.html#axzz388QQjCsK"]MH17 crash: FT photo shows signs of damage from missile strike[/URL] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/EjdUnUu.jpg[/IMG] Sites a bit bitchy about copy and paste so go...
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[QUOTE=TheKingofBees;45458059]good point, but then again there's also the question of why the Ukrainian air force would dispatch a SU-25 to attack the civilian plane in an area where it itself risks being shot down By rebel forces. [editline] 21 july 2014[/editline] pers...
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[QUOTE=TheKingofBees;45457894]I do have to mention that luhansk reported that they had captured their own su-25 so even if there still is a level of uncertainity [URL="http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/13/ukrainian-shell-russian-border-town-donetsk"]the guardian...
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[QUOTE=zupadupazupadude;45457745]The stuff that was shown in the video isn't evidence? (not that I actually watched the video fully, fuck, it's 30 minutes long with a woman speaking in broken English), but I skipped through parts and they actually provided images.[/QUOTE] T...
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[QUOTE=Heisenburger;45457374]What is with the dumb ratings? That was a ministry of defence conference which presented better arguments than Ukraine has in the last 3 days. 1. They showed satellite pictures of the BUK-M1 in Ukraine held territory right before the incident, a...
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[QUOTE=darkrei9n;45456858]And the US claims that it was a SAM site and claim that satellites picked up the launch from rebel territory.[/QUOTE] Is there any video on web with US Defence briefing aswell? I am just asking, are you guys rating dumb out of boredom?
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[QUOTE=Luni;45456771]let me amend that let's wait until we hear from anyone outside of the kremlin[/QUOTE] It's a Russian Ministry of Defence Briefing. Are you going to wait untill CNN will report on it? Like i said, info in RT's article is same as in other Russian Arti...
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[QUOTE=Luni;45456643]karimatrix pls go RT is not a real source[/QUOTE] did you even read what i wrote. i simply presented this as english written report about briefing, their info[B] regarding briefing[/B] is as same as any other in russian news, but in English for FP u...
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Welp, this is.... getting heated up. [quote]The Russian military detected a Ukrainian SU-25 fighter jet gaining height towards the MH17 Boeing on the day of the catastrophe. Kiev must explain why the military jet was tracking the passenger airplane, the Russian Defense Minist...
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[QUOTE=Joazzz;45426559]they said i could be anything so i became a political cartoonist [img]http://files.1337upload.net/karimatrix-86fca7.jpg[/img][/QUOTE] Man, Joazz this is fucking awesome. You know what guys, i can officially say i am out of this thread cause wow th...
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[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;45426525]But if the plane was flying low it would suggest some smaller AA system could be used. Thereby removing the necessity of the rebels having SA11 thereby removing the solid evidence that they have and can use the BUK system.[/QUOTE] Exactly, basicall...
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[QUOTE=Streecer;45426517]was found on a rebel owned twitter account[/QUOTE] Whoa, you know the guy personally?[B] FOR REAL?[/B] Or is it written somewhere that twitter is official news feed for DNR and LNR?
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[QUOTE=Kyle902;45426495]If the rebels could shoot down the Antonov then quite obviously they can shoot down the 777. This logic isn't hard to grasp you know[/QUOTE] Do you even known at wich heigh those planes were fliyng?! compare 4000-5000 m to 10 000m. jeez, come ...
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[QUOTE=Chickens!;45426478]Their plane was going to blow up the moon, thank you russian rebels.[/QUOTE] fixed my typo, sorry. [QUOTE=SexualShark;45426453]go shit post somewhere else[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=Zonesylvania;45426484]rebels: we no take buk, we good separatists, we onl...
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[QUOTE=Killuah;45425970]Of course the Ukraine would not have confirmed that such valuable and powerful equipment has been seized and now after this they sure will NOT backpedal "hey guys we were lying back then but now that a plane was shot down, ummm, yeah they DID seize ...
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[QUOTE=Streecer;45426428][IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bswi16fIYAAiUS1.png[/IMG] Lookie here, it's the image you ignored from earlier in the thread. Even if you don't believe it, please explain to us how the rebels were able to shoot down two Ukrainian fighters wi...
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Ukraine interfax also reported on Yarema's interview [url]http://en.interfax.com.ua/news/general/214197.html[/url] See, it sloowly but surely spreads.
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[QUOTE=Mr. Scorpio;45426386]And all you've got is a few loose screws, apparently. We've officially entered baby talk territory.[/QUOTE] How is interview with goverment prosecutor is a loose screw? As for baby talk, you shoul read up responces in this thread first before sayi...
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[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;45426368]Is there any solid proof that the rebels shot down the plane? Other than a "leaked" conversation which is very probably fake, why would the rebels let a thing like that leak and it wouldn't be the first time such a thing has been faked by Ukrain...
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[QUOTE=Kyle902;45426316]Can you actually give a reason for the Ukraine shooting it down then? I can't think of a single reason Ukraine would have for shooting down a random plane[/QUOTE] How about same reasons they come up with for rebels? Mistake? Panic? not to mention...
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[QUOTE=Jordax;45426263]There are even photo's of them in the city where the flight was flying over when it got shot down, and photos showing them hastily getting removed. It is clear as shit that the separatists are behind it. They are just trying to hide their colossal fuck...
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[QUOTE=Thlis;45426129]If by never agreed on you mean I refuse to accept anything that differs with my opinion then you should probably live under a rock. And by rock I mean Putin's chiseled/flabby pectoral cleavage.[/QUOTE] I am defending my point that being based on t...
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[QUOTE=Demeschik;45426094]The same page later on says that the commander never claimed anything himself, that all official posts from him contain a STRELKOV SAYS image at the bottom (the BUK ones didn't) and that they took the information from group discussions. It seems that ...
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[QUOTE=40kplayer;45426060]From [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Prosecutor_of_Ukraine#Definition]Wikipedia's article[/url] on the General Prosecutor of Ukraine. They would not know that information or be able to give that information, your sources are not as corr...
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[QUOTE=Brandy92;45426053]VK. [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/zf7tBuQ.png[/IMG] No conspiracy here mate.[/QUOTE] Soo what, i got VK and damn page[B] STATES [/B]that it's not his official fucking page! You can even read label that says "Summaries of the shooting of Igor", how doe...
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[QUOTE=Brandy92;45426047]Why would they reveal or admit to having weapons nobody wants them to have? Is it possible the Ukrainians do not want to admit they have them, because possibly they are stolen?[/QUOTE] Soo you'd rather go conspiracy then simply accept it? Oh,...
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I just don't get it. Rebels said, they don't have buks. Ukranian Prosecutor confimred they have no buks. But tweets from internet are heavier then that. I am being buzzed on for ignoring [B]facts[/B] yet when i ask, hey, were are the rest of facts outside labeled pictures i am...
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[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;45426008]You still don't get it, do you? both sides do agree on this matter, but the sources we have agree on something else entirely, and the sources you posted agree on another piece of information entirely.[/QUOTE] Soo, both sides agree on rebels do no...
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[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;45425975]When you find yourself on the losing end of an argument, and can't continue without being told to stop arguing because it doesn't hold any water, I would take that advice. Otherwise, sad consequences tend to result, and dumbs are not one of them.[/...
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[QUOTE=40kplayer;45425969]Hey, could you link that article with the news about the second black box? The website I found does have a free account I could use, but I encountered an error when trying to register the account.[/QUOTE] The one i got was from russian new website bu...
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[QUOTE=cucumber;45425954]you are just shit posting because of your national pride. What you should do right now is, stop posting.[/QUOTE] you take too much credit for advicing me to when stop posting.
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[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;45425945]Funny enough, each of those actually has information tied to it. You're the one who ignored the context of them. Not me. Nice try though. Seriously, just own up to the fact that you're wrong.[/QUOTE] Tied, HOW? Hashtags? article referencig tw...
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[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;45425923]They've been posted several times in this very thread. Also fuck, shit, piss, and cunt; glad I could swear for you.[/QUOTE] Tweet with a guy standing near buk. Tweet with a picture of Strelkov. Tweet with a lonely Buk. And a video from soc...
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[QUOTE=finbe;45425909]Russia does have a history of fucking up black boxes, faked the signal by putting down a radio transmitter as they took the black box to moscow, took them 8 years to give it back.[/QUOTE] Well, don't worry, it's been reported that Ukraninians on site ...
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[QUOTE=cecilbdemodded;45425865]I think the point is that is a crime scene. So you look for survivors and help them if there are any. You put out the fires. What you don't do is start removing evidence unless you are part of the investigation. People who are in a hurry to ...
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[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;45425858]What a garbage excuse. They did it because they don't want anyone from the west touching the thing, and they're incompetents who think that the black box is key to determining who shot it down. Also, its pretty well documented by this point, a...
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[QUOTE=40kplayer;45425811]I also find the confiscated black box suspicious. Why did the separatist take it in the first place? I find it believable that they arrived to search the wreckage for survivors or to confirm what happened, but locating and absconding with the black bo...
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[url]http://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2014/07/18/7032278/[/url] Ukrainian version of article jsut in case. And wait till it get referred by news media. [editline]18th July 2014[/editline] [QUOTE=40kplayer;45425775]Okay, so we've got conflicting unofficial information on bot...
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[QUOTE=40kplayer;45425743]Here, google chrome tried to translate it for me. Unofficial reports of stolen air defense equipment by terrorist group near Donetsk. And then the article screws up there, but it's unclear if it really was.[/QUOTE] Check your google transl...
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[QUOTE=40kplayer;45425704]You did not translate the article I was referring to, and didn't give a link to the other RT article you're referring to. Also, how can the Prosecutor determine that information? That position sounds like a judicial position, not an intelligence on...
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Holly shit, both sides confirm thing, FP peeps still deny it. Amazing.
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[QUOTE=40kplayer;45425677]Would you mind translating it then for us and explaining away any and all bias pravda would have?[/QUOTE] Here is extent from RT's report 06:00 GMT: The militias fighting in eastern Ukraine against the government troops have no weapons systems t...
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[QUOTE=fruxodaily;45425658]I'm not trusting anything that comes directly from Russia[/QUOTE] Excuse me, it's UKRANINAN SOURCE?! Here have [B]OFFICIAL[/B] Ukraine source ffs [url]http://www.mil.gov.ua/news/2014/06/30/teroristi-ne-zahoplyuvali-bojovu-tehniku-chastin-protip...
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Get reckt people. Ukrainian military reported to Poroshenko that rebels did not posess any Buk SAM from Ukranian army. Confirming that rebels have no weapon to shoot down plane. source is [B]UKRAINIAN[/B] [url]http://www.pravda.com.ua/rus/news/2014/07/18/7032278/?attempt=2...
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[QUOTE=zupadupazupadude;45421361]Yes, I'm sure Carlos can enlighten us on who caused this![/QUOTE] Read the rest, guy might be dispatcher who was controlling flight for this damn plane.
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and another one [img]http://s4.pikabu.ru/post_img/2014/07/17/11/1405622960_1816522760.JPG[/img] Link to dispatcher's twitter. [url]https://twitter.com/spainbuca/status/489835522849009664[/url]
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Oh. [img]http://s4.pikabu.ru/post_img/2014/07/17/11/1405622960_1816522760.JPG[/img]
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[QUOTE=jason3232;45420502]Wait what? Seriously?[/QUOTE] yes, but hey, it's TV in Russia soo, wait for other resources yo.
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[QUOTE=MuffinZerg;45420395]It just doesn't look like a false flag because this kind of event has more consequences then one can predict. A typical "border incident" false flag will not be investigates as death of two hundred foreign citizens in a war zone. There is really n...
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If plane was passing by ukrainian ATC, why no one informed crew about danger of entering area? I hope black boxes will clear this up. Also Lugansk folks say it was shoot down by Ukrainian jet.
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