4Channer blackmails people to sending nudes of themselves on Hormone therapy
182 replies, posted
Ah my bad it's a bit hard to get that sometimes through text
Astolfo is super cute and I want to give him a big hug.
like there are two sides of the coin with the term, and this is why I think about it a lot
On one hand, the word itself does have some relation to the concept of deception. The origin of the term doesn't necessarily matter, and over time it's entirely possible that it might evolve into something more pointed and directly harmful. It might just not be worth the trouble it could, might even currently cause. Maybe less loaded terms like femboy are just better(it's certainly more descriptive).
On the other hand, I think the best way to dissolve negative social pressures is to acknowledge and ridicule them. There IS a stigma against showing sexual interest in people you "aren't supposed to". The term acknowledges that, but also implicitly says "hey, but we don't really care, do we?". I think that has some constructive value as well.
I'm not really leaning to either side, I just think it'd be nice if the conversation was built on a more solid foundation of understanding.
Utilizing a more neutral term has the capacity of eliminating all of those worries alltogether, especially given that something like femboy is a lot more unmistakably boy. That way people can stop shitting themselves over traps being gay or not, because asking the question if liking femboys is gay or not can be replied with "hurr durr, what do you think?"
Trap is just kind of a dumb term, it's like calling someone the n word and expecting them to like it, even if all supposedly negative connotation is removed from it.
For those looking for a good word to describe themselves would be femme, personally i never found issue with trap until people pointed out why its offensive. I don't get mad about it but I do understand it, femboy isn't as bad but shemale/tranny are too related to porn for me
having boy in it kind of makes it less ambiguous.
I feel like its also worth while saying that when this all blew up /fit/(?) and /pol/ jumped on this to "reclaim" the robots from r9k, hence the huge hatred and jump on the anti-trans shit
Hating trans people is completely retarded and the people who do it are ironically the defective ones, not the trans people. If they want to pick on defective people so much they should probably hate on themselves.
well there's a problem though
Trap is gender identity neutral, it describes a body/personality type. If you replace it with "femboy" suddenly you've defined characters that identify as women as "boys", and I don't think I don't even need to point out why there are problems with that.
idk, I don't know if there's another term for "cute people with penises" that is both a suitable replacement and doesn't come with its own host of problems
Characters who identify as women are transgender even if they have penises. The whole point of a femboy is someone who identifies as male while at the same time being deliberately feminine as much as possible to my knowledge.
yeah but we aren't talking about the words people use to describe themselves, we're talking about the words people use to refer to the things they're attracted to
there will always be a word that refers to what the word 'trap' refers to. My question is, is there a better alternative? and I'm not entirely sure there is.
I feel that in this context the word trap is probably too broad assuming the potential internal gender difference. I feel that being attracted to a trans girl is very different than being attracted to a feminine boy, because they may quite possibly have rather different perspectives about things.
I dunno' if this is just me, but if you said to me you were into traps, I wouldn't necessarily assume you were also into trans girls, so I'm not sure how effective trap is as a term for that purpose anyway.
Might just be the kinds of circles I spend my time in online, but there generally seems to be a distinction between girls with penises and what people consider traps and some people do seem pretty particular about which they care for. I very rarely see characters/people with actual breasts described as traps, it's intended usage seems to be more specific than that.
I don't think that the audience of people that likes characters like Astolfo/Ferris or comics like Prunus Girl would be much different if those characters identified as women.
Post HRT/Op people fall under shemales/newhalfs, which is its own distinct subgenre(and words that arguably have their own set of problems). This again highlights the point that these terms aren't really related to gender identity, they're related to body type.
Categorizing fictional characters by body types works sort of ok-ish, however when applied to real people it gets a bit more complicated, which is mainly why I personally feel that we should have an unambiguous term for a feminine male individual specifically that refers both to attraction and to identity.
People have a very wide variety of sexual and romantic preferences, and interpreting a feminine individual with a penis as a type of body kind of leaves out those preferences. Not to mention that lots of trans girls would not support someone being attracted to them because they still have a cock.
This doesn't translate as much into English, but a lot of the time with anime you'll get interesting combos of characters using male pronouns/versions of words for themselves (i.e. referring to themselves with 'boku', the male version of I instead of 'watashi', which is acceptable for both men and use to use for themselves, although it is more feminine) while other (or only some) characters use female pronouns for them. You also get a bunch of other nuance and culture stuff that gets kind of flattened out in translation, making it difficult to draw pronoun parallels.
Right, but we're talking about a term that grew out of classifying the body types of fictional characters. We can't have a discussion about what it means and how it could be replaced without talking about it in that context.
You simply cannot argue to me that the term is too vague, or too specific, or not useful, because the fact that it has widespread use, the fact that it's use is so widespread that it has begun to be used to describe actual people and not just fictional characters, is undeniable proof that those criticisms aren't true.
And I'm sorry, but it doesn't matter what you want. It is not within people's power to not be attracted to the things they're attracted to. Again, I think it's rude to refer to people as being "traps" or "milfs" or whatever else, but you can't get rid of the words that people use to describe what they like just because it's inconvenient that they like it.
I think that this is an extremely good point. The words are useful in-context even if they can be slurs when applied to real individuals in a non pornographic context.
In japanese there are male, female, and gender neutral terms, and I can't recall any example of any noticeable group of people being upset that a given character used one or the other.
Again, maybe this is just me projecting. If you think that there are people who would be upset if Astolfo referred to himself as "her", then maybe that's the case. I just haven't seen anything to suggest that.
Oh, not at all! I'm just saying that it can be complicated, I was actually largely agreeing with you and providing context.
Just because lots of people utilize a potentially offensive term does not mean that we cannot argue a hypothetically better term, that was kind of what we were talking about to begin with.
Also please do not assume that I am somehow against people's attractions towards something as long as they are not malevolent.
Telling me that it does not matter what I want is kind of meaningless and rude, I am just talking to a person on the internet about terminologies, I am not here to start a campaign to exterminate ingrained vocabulary.
I apologize if I come across as confrontational, I'm just trying to clearly state my point. This is a heavy subject for a lot of people, and I don't want to cause any unnecessary misunderstandings.
This is a topic that comes up a lot, but you rarely get the chance to tackle in depth.
Actually I think it's because of the guy on /pol/ threatening to commmit a mass shooting.
/pol/
Sure, I've already agreed with that. I just don't really know if there's a superior equivalent term to replace it with.
"Doesn't matter" was the wrong phrase to use. A better way to put it is, I understand people being uncomfortable with other people being attracted to them. But you have to accept that they do, because it isn't something anyone can change. There is a concept that people refer to as "traps", and I don't foresee a world where there isn't a word for that concept.
Never did I think I'd see the day when r9k trap drama of all things would be considered news
Oh, no, it doesn't come across as confrontational at all.
Fucking hell /pol/ is a pox
It is entirely possible that overtime the word will be changed to something a bit more proper, that would define the concept in a way that is much nicer to everyone honestly, and much more clearly.
Right, and that's why I'm talking about this. I want to do what's best.
Like, just to be on the level here, I draw porn. I actually have to think about what to tag what I make. I have to use the terminology other people use. So if that terminology negatively affects the people I care about, I am obligated to do something about it if I can.
So when I say "I don't see an alternative", that isn't the conclusion I want to reach. That's me saying "I'm out of ideas". I want to be wrong here, and hopefully someone can point out something I've missed.
he's probably from /pol/, with the way he uses "degenerate" unironically and has several unrelated /pol/ threads open in his screencaps, and that should pretty much explain everything
Holy shit. Someone shot themselves in the head with a shotgun live on stream!?
I can only imagine the contents of that video.
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