GamersFirst (the owner of APB Reloaded) bought off by Little Orbit
94 replies, posted
The only thing I'm doing is taking cues from you. Since you saw it fit to be condescending and passive aggressive, I see no reason to restrain myself from doing the same. Good job on calling me a tool again, by the way. There has to be some other way of proving that you're correct than insulting your interlocutor, but once again, don't let that stop you.
Also good job on misrepresenting the issue. Silenced weapons aren't completely silent - they're quieter. The sound cue is still present, and in every case it has no impact on the situation. Silenced sniper rifles will be used at a range where their sound isn't audible anyway (with the visual cue of taking damage still being in place), while silenced SMGs will only be usable at a range where they'll be audible anyway.
"harder time dealing with a paid item". Hah. Sure. Let's take the FFA 'Bullshark' into account (disregarding the fact that it's also available to non-paying players through the Marketplace). Its "Burst Avalanche" unique mod alters the burst fire pattern from 3-3-3-3-3-3-3-3 to 2-3-4-5-6-4 and lowers the damage output. Ceasing to fire resets the pattern, so you can't fire off the first 2 rounds from a magazine and start with 3 rounds when you start firing it seconds later. The only unique and unusual gameplay situations this mod creates are ones where you give away your position to deal insignificant damage to the enemy (assuming you hit) and allow them to retreat into cover.
Y'know, this is precisely why I'm not willing to accept your point of view. You're fundamentally misconstruing issues, talking down to me in a condescending tone, insulting me, and trying to put words I've never said in my mouth (see: the strawman bullshit in the first paragraph, with the "lesser being" term).
Lol, you finally decide to address a point i made instead of complaining about me, and the best you have is "its not silent, its quieter!", you have to be joking, no fucking shit it's quieter, and that means the audio cue is harder to hear and won't stand out during other audio in-game. This is an obvious situational advantage, yes we can argue that it's worse shooting a car, but thats the point, it's better situationally and having that option for that situation is a power advantage.
You're also discussing specific items ingame rather than discussing my general point, namely that"balanced" uniques are automatically pay to win due to the advantage in options and uniques, sure you can pick out one that's probably worse, even though we already have a silencer example. Though in your example, if your opponent was counting bursts and was used to the ordinary burst pattern, the odd burst pattern could throw off his counting and therefore gameplay. The uniqueness itself becomes something other players arent used to dealing with and therefore is an advantage.
Honestly dude you're kind of going off the deep end here. You were accusing me of being "unwilling to accept your point of view" and now you're blaming me that you are unwilling to accept my point of view, its like a fucking merry go round and just looks like you're projecting hard.
APB gold rank OBT veteran here. There are definitely items only available from the cash shop which offer distinct advantages by creating new play styles and tactics which normally don’t work with default weapons. A lot of vanilla weapons are more powerful and specialized, but some Armas exclusives are more versatile.
Examples:
ATAC assault rifles offer the best mobility of any other weapon in the same class.
The Manic is an even better version of the ATAC (despite being an SMG) because it has similar stats AND less spread when hip firing.
The Rabid is the only LMG with the same mobility as an ATAC. It is also the only LMG which can be fired from a car window (although it’s accuracy is pretty bad to make up for it)
The Euryale LMG in practice is a straight upgrade to the Shaw LMG in every way except for having a slower time to kill by like 0.02 seconds. This isn’t really saying much
The Whisper SMG cannot be modded like normal variants of the same weapon, but it has hidden stats which give it better accuracy and falloff damage compared to the originals.
The Kris (p90) variant claims to be an OCA skin, but it’s actually a whisper with 2 open slots for mods. Pretty much a straight upgrade unless you’re really want cooling jacket 3.
The NSSW and its skins are untouched by the NTEC range and tap firing nerfs despite being based on that weapon, so it’s pretty much an un-nerfed NTEC with a bigger magazine, but without the ability to shoot out of car windows.
The Dog Ear sniper is now one of the best kept secrets of the game, nobody really uses it but it damages players and cars pretty heavily and can be shot out of windows. It’s ridiculously versatile and has a lower hip fire spread than most assault rifles for whatever reason.
The CSG shotgun in ye olde days which could snipe you from 40 meters away before falloff damage was a thing.
The Troublemaker which was so ridiculously overpowered that it singlehandedly changed the game’s genre from “third person shooter” to “point and click adventure” before it got nerfed into oblivion.
You forgot the STAR LCR, a gun that was so critically underrated that even the developers seemed to forget it existed! I got a good chunk of APB funbucks from some event or someother, and one of the things I bought was a permanent STAR LCR PR2. Now the LCR was amazing because it was so forgotten about. Another thing is when the developers rebalanced move speed for all weapons, they seemingly forgot the LCR; while other Rifles and DMR's make you move at a snail's pace, the LCR lets you move at almost running pace and still retain great accuracy.
Everyone I fought either greatly underestimated what they were up against, or flat out assumed I was using a modded STAR. N-TEC users would challenge me to long range fights, even in the open without cover, and I would beat them. I would kill Obeya and HVR users with it as well. Everyone knew the STAR wasn't the a great gun, and the LCR had an even worse reputation, but I made magic with that thing. It was truly the most underrated weapon I've ever used in a videogame.
All that bickering about balance is another reason Little Orbit should step up and make some much needed balance changes.
With some minor objections here and there (things like: I wouldn't take "ye olde days" into account since, well, that's not a thing anymore), I concede. That's honestly what I've been waiting for - precise examples instead of hearsay bullshit and ad hominem.
well most of the guns listed there didnt exist when I played the worst you could get at the time was the CSG which was just a more annoying variant of the JG (and was later nerfed),
Scoped NTEC which was almost the same thing as the regular one but without open mod slots so you couldnt get my favorite configuration of it, the HVR scout which was like the regular HVR but let you move faster and with the same time to kill but didnt have the obnoxiously large first-hit damage of the regular one and was generally not as good as the default, and the OCA
whisper which was terribly annoying but generally on the mostly same power level as the regular OCA with some of the higher-end mods.
Now, though, I'm not so sure there's stuff like the FAR which seems has the TTK of the NTEC with better accuracy "but a smaller magazine to justify it", the Raptor 45 which has the same 0,7 second TTK as all the really good guns but with siginifantly better full auto accuracy than anything else I've seen available, a bunch of silent HVRs and so many other guns that I just
haven't figured out yet, and a lot of them come with open slots so you don't even get that advantage anymore
but P2W concerns aside, I STILL don't believe that this was the game's major problem, because it had so many more that hurt it a lot more than the crappy weapon balance
It recently occurred to me a potential reason WHY APB updates amount to new cash shop guns and rarely harder versions of existing missions. Ironically thinking to the failure that is Ragnarok Online 2 made to realize this.
Gamersfirst was formerly K2, a company that handled the international versions of some f2p games. All they could do was host the game and possibly add event stuff due to not having both anyone who could actually code to make permanent changes to the game or permission from the developer to do so. Items are easier to edit. This is the way it is for the international/North American version of a lot of Eastern f2p games.
To put it simply: they don't have anyone familiar with the coding of APB that is capable of doing any new content outside of new weapons. New weapons are probably as simple as copying an entry and editing variables. The new engine is an entirely different thing and because they have people who can do THAT, but not add actual content I have no explanation or theory of.
As for how Ragnarok Online 2 figured into this theory: as of 2014 the International version is the only version still running. It has not had new content in years. This was because they got translated content updates from the parent Korean version, which no longer exists now. Back when I played International Ragnarok Online 1, a letter from the GM team pretty much said what I said as why at the time it didn't have any exclusive content. Fast forward to now and they have full rights to the only still running version of a game and since they are just a host with no actual coders or programmers they can't do anything outside of cash shop stuff or in game events using existing content.
Not sure how true it is, but rumor has it the "new engine upgrade" was done entirely by one guy who may or may not have been one of the last RTW employees remaining on the team. Also, the source for RTW employees ever being on the team is also from the developers and of dubious factual quality.
except having a unique gun with unique mods isn't advantageous. each unique gun has a very obvious flaw and weakness that can be exploited, and because of how niche it is they're barely used by even the best players.
if you had played this game at any point for more than a week you'd be able to see that. n-tecs, joker carbines, ocas, hvr's.
"literal game mechanics you cant access without paying money"? hello??? do you even play this game?
you can get all those armas weapons by grinding joker tickets in fight club. you also periodically get free trials on weapons to add on to it.
you can also buy permanent legendary guns that are ARMAS WEAPONS with UNIQUE MODS and skins to combat anyone with armas variants with INGAME MONEY.
there are clearly guns out there that are good on Armas. that being said they still don't compare to the versatility of vanilla weapons no matter how you put it.
but as said before - how many players do you see actually using these weapons? rarely. and that's coming from someone whos played the game for years.
if these guns were truly pay to win no veteran player would be using vanilla weapons. take the meta as proof that what you see as "p2w" isn't actually pay to win.
if i had to count how many people i played with that spent thousands on this game and sucked ass, and how many that spent thousands but still switched back to vanilla, i'd be here for an hour.
also, you should tone down the attitude. your immaturity and abrasiveness oozes out of each post I read by you in this thread alone.
I explained in detail why having a paid situational advantage is an inherent advantage, even with rare niches, and AlbertWesker went into detail on specific items ingame and provided specific examples of advantages for each that exist. I played a shitton of APB ages ago but it has been some time since me and everyone else i knew quit because of all the problems including pay to win, it's likely specific points have changed changed, but the statements i was making are generalized and apply to every game that exists, so replying to me in terms of "oh but because these weapons are shit now its ok" really doesnt address my argument at all. It's just reality that if you have more options you have an advantage, if there is a situation a weapon is better at and one player needs to pay money to access it then the player that does has an advantage... this really isn't obvious?
I have very little patience for arguments in favor of ruining decent game concepts with objective pay to win, if that comes through my posts as abrasiveness, good. Don't reward bad practices then act surprised when the long term health of a game gets fucked because everyone who wasn't buying all the competetive guns left.
hey dont forget the nano, the best secondary sidearm since it's basically an auto FBW. And before the drop-off update, could snipe far away
except when it comes to apb, situational advantage isn't as specific considering all mission objectives can be fought with a variety of different play styles.
as much as he went into detail those guns aren't all that they're hyped up to be. there's a reason why those guns aren't used often.
also
people left APBR because under its previous management there was no hope for it. the content released was lackluster and provided little to no game play changes.
new game modes and maps were half-assed and the game had (and still does have) many bugs. engine update still hasn't come around, and the old devs were being laid off.
people left APBR because people were being silenced and evaded by staff with little to no explanations or responses for what the future has in store for the game.
just more false promises that get delayed over and over. then there's the hacking problem which seemed to be more popular in the past too. bad optimization, toxic community.
plenty of reasons why people left the game and why its dead. gun balancing was broken too, most of all, even for vanilla weapons. they nerfed, buffed, and nerfed constantly, both vanilla and
armas weapons and now the balancing is uneven. P2W, as much as I like to believe is barely there, isn't the games biggest problem. it's the game itself.
and if you have little patience for opposing viewpoints, maybe you should take a breather and have some self control before even initiating. calling people dumb, stupid, or any other names of belittlement because you're frustrated doesn't help you at all.
Another perpetual problem in the game was there were certain camp spots that were nigh impossible to dislodge without certain weapons. Among the best was a highly skilled grenade launcher to straight up mortar them out. But the grenade launcher was among one of the most expensive to lease and use, and just having it didn't mean you were highly skilled with it.
All of this. APB was my main for several years but I stopped playing in 2012 a little while after they implemented the threat-based districts that killed the matchmaking. Coincidentally, I picked it back up about a week before this announcement. Since Little Orbit did their blog post the districts have been pretty full and it's alright to pick up and play. If anyone wants into the FP Enforcer clan on Jericho (North America server, formerly Joker), message FPChonch ingame. I'll give you some free clothes and a car.
Legendary weapons really shouldn’t be considered in the same class as vanilla F2P weapons due to how rare they are. Just obtaining one takes a ridiculous amount of time and effort which many people just eventually give up on because they can’t take the toxic community, rampant cheating, and bullshit tactics made possible by incredibly unbalanced missions, weapons, and matchmaking.
Anyone who just plays casually are at a disproportionately huge disadvantage due to expiration dates on the majority of F2P weapons, which means they have to spend in-game money on several weapons each time they log on to not be restricted to 1 or 2 different play styles or tactics. But that’s beside the point.
Even if you manage to get a legendary weapon from the market, someone still had to buy it first through Armas loot boxes. Yes some of the most powerful weapons available are locked behind gambling. Here’s some more examples for everyone, with just legendary weapons.
Before damage falloff was a thing, the nano was the only full auto machine pistol that could snipe people out to around 70 meters (just 30 meters away from the games maximum effective range!) It’s still one of the most accurate machine pistols in the game, but is thankfully no longer a full auto DMR like a secondary STAR LCR. It does however still have the highest stamina damage of any lethal secondary weapon and will stun players who are mildly tagged by a few shots from any stun guns. Combined with the stun grenade launcher, you are basically unbeatable 1vs1.
The Ursus assault rifle is an NTEC which can kill you in 5 shots instead of 6. It had a slightly lower rate of fire but again was never touched by the NTEC nerfs. Now it’s arguably a straight upgrade.
The Condor isn’t entirely overpowered stats wise due to having a longer kill time than most other assault rifles, but it’s like a primary Nano because the accuracy doesn’t really go down if you decide to mag dump the thing. Also it’s the only weapon in the game with a suppressor which doesn’t make you appear on the map (provided you use 3 round bursts and wait for the gun to cool down). The first 3 shots you take will never appear on the map.
The Colby Commander is exactly the same as the 44 revolver, but it can shoot through breakable map objects and players. This includes portable shields which players can deploy as cover.
The CAP 40 Sergeant is an SMG with the same piercing mechanics as the Commander.
The firework launcher is a straight upgrade to the flare gun because it fires in a straight line instead of an arch. It’s also permanent unlike the flare gun.
The Jersey Devil and Bloody Mary (Tec 9) machine pistol variants have better starting accuracy than the vanilla full auto machine pistols. Although the accuracy goes to crap if you mag dump, rapidly using short bursts allows you to maintain accuracy for targets that aren’t within hugging range. Also the switch time on the Jersey Devil is nearly instantaneous.
Oh boy now onto my favorites:
The Yukon machine pistol has the fastest kill time in the game at 0.5 seconds. Anyone who whips this out at point blank range WILL kill you if they aren’t lagging. Also it has pretty decent accuracy when fired in burst mode which makes it lethal when used with an NHVR or other heavy weapons.
The Medusa LMG is what the Euryale was based on. It has more recoil than the Euryale when you first start shooting, but after about 1.75 seconds the recoil becomes nonexistent and allows you to snipe unsuspecting players from 70 meters away.
The True Ogre was buffed, a lot. Went from being the worst shotgun in the game, to one of the best. It’s a very situational weapon like most shotguns in the game, but it’s an automatic shotgun with an 18 round magazine. Even with its small windup before shooting, it will decimate anything in the general direction you’re aiming at within 15 to 20 meters. It also can completely screw up the aim of your enemies because APB handles particle effects very poorly. The True Ogre causes the enemy’s game to render so many pellets, bullet impacts, and blood effects that some people get reduced to 10 FPS when being shot by it. The only way to prevent this is to edit the games configuration files to put a limit on particle effects (yes this game by default has no limits on particle effects lmao) and launch the exe directly to prevent the game from reverting your particle settings. Alternatively you can use the APB Advanced Launcher which was made by a third party to work around APBs terrible optimization and lack of graphic settings. You need to edit game config files just to not get killed by the FPS lag this weapon produces.
I own all of these examples except for the Nano and Bloody Mary, which I sold to get other legendary weapons.
Me at the first screen on the right. I lost the count on how many times I experimented with my characters' design.
The Joker Box legendaries were fucking absurd. Up until the Nanos nothing in the game was P2W and you could very easily fight against anyone with any mods. Even the starter weapon unmodded was a beast if you knew how to use it, what gave this impression was people having confirmation bias play up whenever they lost a onesided mission, and having a game as unfair as APB can be, that is easy to happen.
That all changed with the Joker Boxes tho, I still remember the Oca Nano launch, that thing was a fucking nightmare. Still, let's share some more characters.
https://i.imgur.com/oykAfMq.png
I made like, at least 6 distinct characters, of which my main characters evolved quite a bit. My original characters were based off Zoey and the Witch from Left 4 Dead, but steadily became their own thing while retaining those character designs as a base. One character was Rei from Evangelion because I watched that at around the time, another was a Doctor. Another was designed after a picture I saw, and the last was me attempting to make a Korean but everyone just said she looked White vv
My character (Scandiv) went from grunt-looking security dude to tactical officer once I started throwing money at this game. Honestly I've got no regrets because I've had alot of fun with this game.
Might as well post some FP screenshots too. I have shit ton of more but these are the ones I quickly found.
Can't believe this is from 2011 in June.
http://puu.sh/Anhnk/e1df3e6847.jpg
Rest are from 2012
http://puu.sh/AnhpA/927918ad07.jpg
http://puu.sh/Anhqo/996fc66a40.jpg
http://puu.sh/AnhqZ/2f1237d342.jpg
http://puu.sh/Anhs5/fc1523cfc4.jpg
this game was a total pile of crap at times but i'll always miss the customization
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/320124999990549099/6A5446B26132307E3C845A508A3F1868E128E7D2/
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/320124366285249415/06451A8520741FB87DF289A2FB058A3053C2FE4E/
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/320123842394023265/13F0CEC8F0449DE9E74602DA519D3C791D336992/
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/52121507441823875/AA512C400B577F1C3C400B000CBC62FDD1E0EFEB/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iz_BccphTIw
Joker East represent.
Hell yeah. They merged NA East and West into one single NA server Jericho now though so you'll get weird looks if you mention "Joker."
Post more character outfits!
https://www.dropbox.com/s/r4qxt2yx3mm43wa/newuniform.jpg?dl=0
I had to dig around to find these..
[t]https://i.imgur.com/sw0RVFy.jpg[/t]
https://i.imgur.com/ybdVZSj.jpg
