Rumor: JJ is a hack, Star Wars Episode IX to bring back iconic Star Wars Villian - Sensationalist Headlines

The same reason Warp Speed is largely not weaponized in plenty of other Sci-Fi universes. Ships are fucking expensive compared to the already expensive munitions they normally carry. So is Manpower in its own way. FTL-Ramming ships is not something one casually does, y'know given the fact that you're sacrificing a very expensive piece of hardware and any crew on-board performing said maneuver.

Also, it's not like FTL ramming would have stopped either Death Star, anyway. The Executor slammed nose first into the Death Star II and barely even made a dent.

Rant videos stated that ramming a droid manned cheaper ship into something like a death star or a star destroyer is an incredibly worthy use of resources.

Oh fuck yeah, this means the next Nerd Crew is going to be great

Given the complete devastation that was shown to the ship in TLJ the death star would likely be ripped to shreads.

Here's another explanation then: Star Wars was never really Hard Sci-Fi, and George Lucas never really gave these kinds of scenarios thought - At least not in the way better and more experienced Sci-Fi writers like Heinlein, Clarke, or Cherryh would.

I understand but TLJ went fucking HARD on the whole not being hard thing given that we have not seen such a thing in the star wars universe before to my awareness which is why it made a lot of people perplexed.

Remember that thing Obi-Wan used to let his personal fighter go to hyperspace? Why not just launch them at the enemy?

We already had a galaxy composed entirely of livable single-biome planets, along with massive ship battles that make no use of 3 dimensional space whatsoever, and gravity that simply does not work like it does in the real world at all. (Remember in Episode 3 when R2-D2 shocks the buzz-droid, and it slides off of Anakin's starfighter like they're fighting in a fucking atmosphere or something?)

Why a young Sheev tho? Just recast Ian.

Feel like you're missing my point here. My point isn't that TLJ is perfect and flawless - it very clearly isn't. The B-plot was a complete clusterfuck, structurally. The explicit moral was dumb (although the implicit, super-meta "stop putting your heroes on pedestals" one was great). The ending dragged on way too long. But instead of looking at it as a piece of art, you're finding things to quibble about in-universe, and then making broad meta-fictional complaints. Who the fuck cares that a Star Wars story had nonsensical military strategy? The entire series is built on "do stuff that's rad". AT-ATs were militarily nonsensical in ESB, but they were rad so who gives a shit? Having space battles take the form of dogfights is scientifically ludicrous, but they were so awesome that they made an entire game trilogy and like a bajillion books based on Rogue Squadron. There's a time and a place for thoroughly-researched speculative fiction in a hard sci-fi setting, but Star Wars is not and has never been the place for it. And then you complain that it ditched the Expanded Universe. As someone who read and even kinda enjoyed the Yuuzhan Vong saga, let me tell you something: the old EU was full of shitty stories. We got how many new Death Stars, either literally new Death Stars or other OP superweapons to take down with a small, risky assault? I can't even count them. How many "OT character turns Dark and then comes back" stories did we get? And then repeated with a new generation when people finally realized how dumb it was getting? The best thing that could have happened was what Disney did - they're treating it the same way the MCU movies treat the Marvel comics. It's a giant pile of ideas, some brilliant, some awful, and you try to distill it down into something new and better. Take what worked and make it fit a more cohesive whole; take the good ideas from otherwise bad stories and make them work; take the bad ideas and throw them away. About the only argument you made about it as an actual piece of fiction, an argument relegated to a single sentence, was that it didn't progress the plot enough. Which, fair enough, it definitely didn't advance all the plot threads it had running. It was clearly more focused on character growth than plot advancement. That's probably what the series needed at this point, the new protagonists and antagonists were a lot flatter than they should have been after TFA, and needed some rounding out and development.

I mean it happened in legends, and I don't think it's necessarily out of the question as a possibility in universe. As far as being accurate there are already cases in current canon of sith inhabiting the bodies of the living (See The Old Republic), clones are already a thing, and there are already plenty of established force ghosts. Honestly that would have been less jarring than what happened in TLJ for me, and would have made more sense. Honestly I blame TLJ for leaving JJ with a train wreck, and while I've gotten over it and think its OK (slightly better than ROTS) it still leave a shit ton of garbage that he's got to deal with. Who knows though, considering that they threw maul in Solo for whatever reason we could end up with some other character.

I am not entirely sure what the purpose of your counter argument is because nothing that you are saying inherently disagrees with anything that I have mentioned.

I just hope this one gives the Bigger Luke theory the respect it deserves and makes it canon.

I actually have a really cool headcanon about this. What happens when you smash a couple atoms into something at 99% of lightspeed? You get a massive amount of radiation, crazy funky subatomic particles, blasting out the back of it. Scale that up to a giant starship slamming into another giant starship, at 10,000% of lightspeed. Physics can't tell you what would happen (superluminal velocities break too many rules already) but it seems an obvious conclusion that you'll get a giant fucking blast of radiation, in an expanding cone out the back. Enough radiation to strip planets bare of life for thousands of light-years. Probably moving faster than light. The Rebels never did it before because they didn't want to obliterate entire planets worth of people. The Empire never did it before because the Alliance never really presented them with big enough target to be worth it. And maybe it's slow enough that you can evacuate, given time, which is why the Empire invested in Death Stars instead. Now, this is just a headcanon, but I do kind of hope they pick up on that and make something of it. It's something the Rebels would have to answer for. Instead of a purely noble sacrifice in a series fucking lousy with noble sacrifices, it was an impulsive, reckless one. My point is that you're arguing for the sake of arguing. You're scouring the movie for anything that can possibly be described as a flaw, so you can win points at dumb internet arguments rather than looking at it as a cohesive whole. Criticizing art serves two purposes: it tells audiences whether or not something might interest them, and it tells artists what to do and not to do. You - and similar ultra-nitpicky Star Wars ranters - fail at both. Nobody walks into a Star Wars movie and goes "Oh boy, I sure hope this has lots of REALISTIC SPECULATIVE MILITARY STRATEGIES for how wars will be fought in space". It's a movie where space wizards can reflect laser guns with their laser swords, it is clearly playing by its own rules. Yelling about how it disrespected years and years of canon (which were dumb and bad and literally the first thing Disney got rid of when they bought it) doesn't tell new artists what to do, other than maybe not to try to pander to self-entitled obsessive manbabies.

If there is one person who appears to be arguing for the sake of arguing it would be you, I was not specifically arguing with anyone I was just mentioning material that was included in some criticism videos as well as a bunch of straightforward personal opinions that are neither right nor wrong. If you think that the flaws that were pointed out are incorrect or inaccurate that is absolutely fine. If you enjoyed the last jedi that is also completely fine I do not judge you nor hate you for it.

Since I'm not sure what we counting as plot holes, contrivances or things that don't fit into canon for the sake of this discussion, I'll just list a bunch: RETCONS: -Leia kissing luke/implied to be romantic interest in ANH, despite them later revealed to be siblings. Done because the whole sibling subplot wasn't thought up when the first film was being scripted. -Grand Moff Tarkin is indicated to be Vader's superior in ANH. Then Vader is suddenly the right-hand man of the Emperor. The concept of the Emperor didn't exist yet when the first film was made. -Obi Wan is supposed to be 'undercover' on tatooine while watching over Luke. As such he dresses in an inconspicuous sand-repealing robe similar to what the locals wear, and it just so happens that this outfit is later revealed to be the official uniform for jedi knights of the republic. Not very inconspicuous. PLOT HOLES: -The imperials on the star destroyer that captures Leia's blockade runner at the beginning of the form choose to let an escape pod go because there wasn't any life signs, despite robots apparently being a very common thing in this universe and that fact that (if we're considering the prequels) droids used to make up the majority of armed forces before the intervention of clone troopers. I realize that clone troopers had since been gradually replaced by regular human troops since the time of the prequels, but the idea that the imperials either couldn't detect droids with their sensors or didn't consider the possibility that the enemy could send machines with compromising intel aboard an escape shuttle seems like a plot contrivance. -Darth Vader is clueless about the existence of his own children up until he is given a clue by the Emperor in TESB, despite the fact that other members of his family can seemingly sense each other over long distances. Even though Vader doesn't face Luke personally until their fight in Cloud City, they are in the same room in ANH when Obi Wan sacrifices himself to allow the heroes to escape and later on they are in a dogfight together over the death star. It's explainable that Luke and Leia cannot sense each other or Darth until TESB as their force powers are still developing, but Vader as a trained force user should be able to sense both of them as well as their connection to him. This is particularly noticeable because Leia uses her growing force sensitivity to find Luke over a long distance in TESB discover Luke is her brother in ROTJ and Vader uses his powers to read Luke's mind and discover the same. -The montage sequence on Dagobah implies that Luke trains with Yoda suggests that the process of Luke learning to be a Jedi takes several weeks or even months. However, the Millennium Falcon is shown to travel from Hoth to Dagobah in a relatively short period of time, despite the detour in the asteroid field. Since Luke abandons his training to save his friends, the whole montage sequence couldn't have taken more than a day or two. Despite this, when Luke gets back in ROTJ Yoda tells him he has nothing left to learn except to defeat Darth Vader. So why did Yoda try to tell him he wasn't ready when he went to confront Vader and save his friends at Cloud City? -Despite Luke's lineage supposedly bring a secret, he keeps the last name Skywalker. Presumably people knew who Anakin Skywalker was. Wouldn't people be a bit curious why a dirt farmer on tatooine had the same last name as the second in command of the empire and a dark lord of the sith? More importantly, why didn't Vader put two-and-two together? LOGIC PROBLEMS -As mentioned previously in this thread, the problem of 'GRAVITY IN SPACE!!!?' is present, in one way or another, in all of the films. The X-Wings and Y-Wings are build like WW2 fighter planes. They have wings despite there being no air resistance in place for wings to serve any purpose, like providing lift. They fly like WW2 fighter planes, always travelling toward the nose and turning by banking left or right, not how actual spacecraft travel. Real space vehicles need manuevering thrusters to turn and keep traveling in the same direction regardless of their yaw, pitch or roll until enough thrust is applied from the engines to firstly slow down in the direction of travel and then alter the trajectory to speed up in the new direction. All of the bombers/torpedo ships use simple poop-chute style launchers, which require gravity to function. -The humans of the galaxy far, far away have such advanced technology that they can travel faster than light as well as construct sentient robots and practical laser weaponry. Despite this their advanced space warships have to manually swivel their guns like WW2 battleships, if only to allow the small WW2-style fighter ships to dodge and weave through their defenses effortlessly. In this galaxy, humans of the far, far future and yet less technologically advanced 21st century have been able to implement the concept of electronic warfare and automated gun turrets despite having made none of the former technological advancements. -Laser weapons seem far too impractical for many of the kind of uses we see them used for in the films, especially when it comes to fighting against trained force users with light sabers. The worst thing that would happen when firing a bullet against a light saber wielding foe would be the bullet being incinerated by the blade of hot plasma. A laser shot instead gets deflected and turned into a potentially lethal projectile for the other team. -The Millenium Falcon is said to be 'the fastest hunk of junk in the galaxy' (so at least fairly fast compared to the average ship in the Star Wars universe). Han says the ship can travel about 'point 5 past lightspeed'. This is no where near fast enough for any of the distances traveled in the movies to be traveled in the time that takes place. For reference, in real life the closest other solar system to ours is around 4.2 lightyears away (meaning it would take 4.2 years to reach it at the speed of light).

I mean at the end of the day this was kind of an old hat the second time. me personally if they do in fact go this route since I was a sucker for Dark Empire and Empire's End and consider those the end of the Skywalker arc, I'd say go for it if pulled off with a good director and writer. Then again, I thought TFA was great and TLJ was a C+ so what do I know I'm the black sheep usually.

I take it you're not fond of the Timothy Zahn novels? Cause those are what I personally considered to be the end of the Skywalker saga back in the day. Specifically, the end of the Hand of Thrawn Duology was the absolute end, as far as I was concerned, because the war between the New Republic and the Empire was finally over for good. I hated everything that came after, from the Vong saga all the way to fucking Legacy and it's thorough undoing of the original trilogy's victories rivaled only by Disney's movie sequels.

I hope they bring in the one dude in the EU that has like 6 lightsabers glued to his body.

It's kind of weird seeing you argue so adamantly about TLJ considering

Sorry, I guess I accidentally came off as being overly confrontational and created the impression that I hated the opposing side which is not the case.

best I could technobabble up is: > ships capable of warp that carry enough mass to do this instead of just vaporize into the ether are far too costly to produce explicitly for carbombing > reaching warp speeds has an acceleration period before going FTL/Quantum and that wild shotgun only happens in the initial acceleration phase, as FTL/Quantum Drive travel operates on a different level of physics and may not actually interfere with other ships also starkiller base's plasma balls were FTL somehow, weren't they? I remember a scientific theory that assume that if there's a sufficiently advanced civilization out there, they may have already weaponized near-FTL mass based projectiles to accelerate toward and obliterate planets they deem threats in order to protect themselves from rising opposition not sure why so many people love "spacefaring aliens that lasted long enough to get into space are also heartless warmongering dicks" theories when that's not working out too well for humans already lmao

I think that faster than light travel itself may not be mandatory to use during the actual collision. The object would get accelerated in the warp and then released into physical space at a ludicrously high but already significantly slower then warp speed but would still function as a bullet shortly before colliding with the target. Also as mentioned earlier it could be reasonable to attempt doing so with a very large asteroid. given the sort of destruction even a comparatively slow asteroid that collided with earth can do, a recently exiting warp asteroid would still be a lightning bolt of power. The idea of a highly developed war mongering civilization always seemed paradoxical to me because in order to reach that level of civilization complexity one would need to possess an immensely high emotional and ethical intelligence in order to coordinate everything and to prevent it from collapsing on itself.

RE 'recently-exiting-warp asteroid', the problem with this is the 'quantum drive' like effect warp seems to have. There's no inertia, it's almost like teleporting forward while sitting still, with whatever momentum you had. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4GppY9Vh0k having said that you could probably just plop the asteroid and its existing travel into a collision path with little reaction time and it'd still do its thing?

In the movies on the Millenium Falcon the blur of the stars was gradually turning back into dots as it was slowing down. Perhaps the perfect time for a collision with the target is as soon as the object starts to slow down so that it's slow enough to be materialized into actual space yet still ludicrously fast to act as a projectile. If the Falcon were to warp drive a certain distance towards a different example asteroid and start to slow down before the actual full stop destination it would probably still travel several tens of thousands of miles slowing down while still moving ultra quickly which is probably when you do it and when in falcon's example it would collide ultra hard with the asteroid and probably turn both objects to powder.

Can we drop this “you dislike TLJ you must be a neck beard” meme, please? I’m so tired arguing about this movie, but every time people bring up this idea that everybody just wants to hate it for no reason, I just feel like I have to do the whole thing over again.

Unless it was recorded and added for the special edition, Tarkin does mention the Emperor in the board room scene when he talks about the senate having been dissolved.

Oh, really? Oh well nevermind then. I think the part with Vader being Tarkin's subordinate and then being retconned into the Emperor's righthand man still applies. The concept of the emperor as he appears in ROTJ definitely didn't exist yet though, since prior to the special edition the emperor looks like this in TESB: https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/111789/d7735653-5492-463c-ae24-c60df9b2eef6/tumblr_o644urfR7o1s7zy0eo1_r1_540.jpg

Isn't it time Star Wars got an reboot? They ruined the last movie and killed of the villian with "jedi" that didn't get any training.