• 'Traditional masculinity' deemed harmful
    104 replies, posted
https://www.foxnews.com/health/american-psychological-association-deems-traditional-masculinity-harmful-could-lead-to-sexual-harassment Fox News decided to report on these guidelines from August 2018. They used a quote from Dr. McDermott during the news coverage, and his email inbox has been getting pounded with death threats.
Please don't post Fox News opinion pieces, use it for factual articles only, and even then, cautiously. also wow those comments are terrible
Isn't this pretty obvious? I wanna say I'm not surprised that Fox News is twisting this into a negative but man fuck. I thought they'd be pretty mad at how many men commit suicide because they were raised to never share their emotions
Actually, opinion pieces are apparently banned entirely in SH, I wasn't aware of that. Opinion pieces are not news.
Fair play. I wasn't certain whether or not it would count as an opinion piece since they published it as an educational article instead of an opinion one.
It's not labeled or presented as an opinion piece but in my opinion it reads enough like one.
The video itself is pretty opinionated, however, the actual writing is stating things from the guidelines in a very factual manner. If they removed the first line of the report, it would be a very functional description of the guidelines that I would expect from an undergraduate report. Again, apologies if this is actually just an opinion piece. I don't see a way to delete the thread on my end.
Many parts of traditional masculinity are just bad for men.
Even if it fox news, “Traditional masculinity ideology has been shown to limit males’ psychological development, constrain their behavior, result in gender role strain and gender role conflict and negatively influence mental health and physical health,” the report warns. I can't really argue with that. How many times are boys and men given the impression they shouldn't do something because they'd be a "pussy" or if the thing just isn't "cool"?
I have another source here: American Psychological Association links 'masculinity ideology' .. Then again this isn't a surprise, psychologists, feminists and many more have denounced this for decades.
https://www.artofmanliness.com/articles/bosom-buddies-a-photo-history-of-male-affection/ And heck, men aren't even allowed to show any of their negative emotions besides anger without being deemed unmanly.
It's really great about how the gender that most men are attracted to is simultaneously used as leverage against any personality they could have in themselves.
Yeah excellent fucking wording there, the "traditional" masculinity which exists only in the last century, in no way connected to actual masculinity
Thanks for a better source. Though, now that I see that NBC is reporting on it as well, I'm curious what brought this about. These guidelines aren't really new.
Traditional femininity toxic as well, ban the women.
https://files.facepunch.com/forum/upload/716/6790ff86-e8b1-4aa4-9b53-fe63d0572b0e/image.png
Im kind of only finding out who i am now because i've denied everything and swept it under the rug because "no, im a man" Im only recently realizing its okay to not conform to those expectations of masculinity. Im 24.
Whatever happened to the idea of the good father? It just seems like everyone's fucking obsessed with being Duke Nukem when they should think of Odin.
"Leader"
That's a discussion I've heard at some conferences as well (not as a presentation mind you, so these aren't official statements like with males). Gender roles can be harmful, regardless of which gender we look at. I've wondered a few times if there was a better way to phrase these issues to show that the field is doing this to produce healthier individuals. My concern is even if we had brand new terminology, eventually, they likely would get brought back in to the argument and the situation would be at square one again.
Its created gender role biases in our society that to this day still persist because it isn't manly to acknowledge them. Examples include divorce heavily favoring women and men being forced to pay child support when they're the rape victim.
There's a study about bullying that shows that while boys will hit or punch each other, they don't tend to try and destroy each other socially. Girls aged 13-19 who are on social media however don't hit or punch each other. They destroy each others social connections through all sorts of hostile methods. The most at risk group in Western society is teenaged girls, they've seen their suicide rates massively skyrockets while boys have seen a 2-3% increase(still terrible) it's something like a 19% increase for girls. It's not something people talk about. It's completely overshadowed by the obvious elephant in the room, violence. It stands out, so we deal with it, but we ignore the reality of the dangers of social media and the society we've put kids into.
Exactly - terrible stereotypes of the detritus of society have taken over. Even worse are those who muddy the waters, allowing the weak to be weak and confused until terrible things occur. If everyone wants to larp as Duke, so be it, but at least blatantly tell everyone to do so and not "just be urself" tier bullshit What happened to discipline? Principles? Actual stoicism? Genuine goodness? There is no solving this problem by wishing it away, because the source is ourselves, and not culturally, but genetically. Previously we channeled this idiocy into doing great things, now it's all allowed to emerge all for the sake of liberation. Then, some poor dude/girl realizes this truth, and idiocy like school shootings happen, because if they attack him with a bronze age level mentality, the dude will go into caveman mentality just to compensate and fuck them over even more (and the supreme fuckover in caveman tier being to kill someone like a troglodyte, good fucking job) Then we have girls, who are supposed to later literally create new people from scratch pretty much (this is never mentioned, in order to make prospective mothers lose their pride of literally being the main contributor of civilization itself going forward, which makes us ask ourselves what the FUCK are our Betters of Society seeking to achieve) larp as some sort of Judge, jury, and executioner, reveling in any opportunity to fuck someone's social life because they can. And then they raise further sociopaths and defectives, and the chain goes further and further until either someone puts the foot down and makes them behave (which would result in immediate bloodshed), or society falling apart and someone simply swiping away the rest into the trash (also bloodshed, but even worse) People think humans are so simple and good bois who have no obsoleted instinctive behaviors that if left unchecked will literally send you back to the stone age except the cavemen have firearms so the violence is extra. Now that the navel-gazers are being catastrophically proven wrong, they refuse to accept that they have been wrong, and claim that even more disruption of natural law will fix the problem. Well guess what it fucking won't. When I said that people need to be modified genetically to prevent these things and many others (addiction to entertainment, internet, being overwhelmed by information, etc etc, most of them being merely feedback that was never designed to handle the modern world's size and speed) asap, they don't believe me, say that I think too much about these things, that it'll be fine. No it won't be, the beast within us is already ruining the planet. The root of all these problems is us, yet nobody dares open that can of worms for obvious reasons, but the Pandora's box will have to be opened soon lest we implode
There are tons of problems with our society. That doesn't mean that we revert to old traditions. Some, hell, a lot of them were causing problems in ways that weren't seen at that time. We need to look at our own society more, and ourselves more often, but the idea that you literally need to genetically alter the human race to no longer enjoy the things you mentioned is just asinine. Might as well just view humans as soulless automatons.
My name is not important
On the other hand, some traditions are the reason why we're even this far ahead in the first place. I genuinely don't believe that 'traditional masculinity' will ever disappear. It will only mutate like the masculine ideal has done throughout history. What we have now is a combination of not keeping a check on why certain things were positive traits in the first place, societal pressures imposing them to the detriment of our individual being, and pushing and mutating them to an illogical extreme (Being strong =/= Never ever crying or you become a pussy for life). I don't know how this will play out in the future, but I hope that one day masculinity(and femininity while we're at it) can be ideals that we can aspire to, and not the massive mixed bags we all have to shoulder. Good on you man. I'm 20, and while I never even tried to conform, it's only recently that I've managed to improve myself as a person and find a semblance of self-worth on my own terms. Keep on being the best you you can be, standards be damned.
Actually it is talked as is one of the topics tackled by Feminism: why girls grow on the culture of seeing each other as rivals and having to compete for men/social acceptance. Is one of these "accepted stereotypes" that society have with women like "women have to look and act beautiful and delicate" or "women are expert caretakers by genetics".
Maybe some are talking about it, but the focus is on boys, male violence, and the issues stemming from men being "toxic".
It really sounds like you've only been exposed to the very surface level of "pop-feminism," the real feminist dialogue is significantly more nuanced and inclusive than that. There's also a big problem surrounding feminist topics where feminism becomes "soft-strawmanned" by generalized outrage culture and anti-SJW culture. The most common criticisms of feminism are blown significantly out of proportion, and the man-haters are both quieter and much less numerous than we often consider them to be. It's easy to fall into the trap of getting angry at false outrage and assuming that that outrage corresponds to a legitimate issue with feminism itself. It mostly doesn't.
I'm sure that is true, but in the mainstream sphere, it's focused around how men cause the problem as early as childhood
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