Parents who raise children as vegans should be prosecuted, say Belgian doctors - Sensationalist Headlines

I don't see how you possibly wouldn't raise them athiest, even if you weren't going out of your way to do so. Assuming you have absolute zero religious paraphernalia in your homes and avoid watching religious focused videos or television (because you're an atheist, obviously it wouldn't interest you) how is your kid going to be raised any other possible way? Are you going to purposely take them to a church, synagogue and a mosque every so often to present "different choices"? I sincerely doubt so.

Dude, why the fuck do you argue you like this? No one even remotely brought this up, it's not even remotely what anyone is arguing for. This is a complete and intentional misreading to be as uncharitable to the person you're speaking with as possible

Are people just deliberately ignoring the reason they're doing this? Because most vegans in belgium haven't provided their kids with proper food that they need. Sure you -can- do it, but obviously most did not.

"Veganism good, anything else bad" Okay, so we can see where you stand on this argument, as an emotionally engaged and intellectually bereft of any arguments to offer, you're just going to post "gotcha" level shit, huh? If a kid wants to eat vegan, then the parents need to make sure that kid is getting all the forms of nutrition not supplied by a vegan diet(Because vegan diets are lacking in many different things that are bodies need, and doubly so when we're growing). If a kid isn't going to be vegan, meat use like the rest of the world should be minimized to a mere 20-40 grams per meal. That's not "EAT A FUCKING COW" levels of protein, nor does it require such bullshit levels of outraged based reasoning to realize this. jesus Akz, you've gone off the deep end.

There were a dozen posts on the first page that explicitly discussed child nutrient versus adult. What are you talking about in deliberately ignoring?

because people get so worked up over non-issues why should i approach them lightly. diet and health is more important than a child's freedom to choose an animal to eat.

Yet literally no one gives a fuck about just capitulating to the childs wants, if you'd actually read what people are saying.

This is not entirely true. You can get a full variety of all nutritional needs from a plant based diet, it's just exceptionally difficult, and even more so if you don't know what you're doing (such as being vegan for political reasons rather than dietary then pushing them on kids not understanding their needs differ from an adults). To be a vegan and get the full range of nutrition needed, one really needs to research and learn about the diet, what the body needs, and what plants provide what. Its completely possible, but probably more tedious than what people want to put an effort into.

Why must the discussion of religion come up in the house? I understand the point of "well, if you don't take them to any places of worship, isn't that inherently atheistic' and I'd argue it's a matter of intent. It's not a point of "I'm not taking them there because I don't want them to be religious". Hell, I don't think the discussion would arise until the point gets raised in school, at which point I imagine the kid would come home and ask questions, to which I would hope to keep my personal education bias-free. Give them a choice of what they want to believe, no matter how trivial; if my kid says they want to be a Hindu because they like the look of Ganesh, more power to them. If I didn't feel confident in my ability to present my accurate interpretations of each religion, I'd do my research or encourage them to do so, or even ask their educator to do so (if at that point the educator has their own bias, I've at least tried on my part to remain impartial). I'm no fan of the woman, but I think of my mother when we come to this topic. She was raised in a family that all ate meat, and she was raised in that from the standpoint of "this is just what we personally do", as opposed "this is what we want you to do as well". Is there some underlying influence on the child? Yes. Is that done on purpose, and with intent to raise the child to be a mirror of the parents, though? No. At around age six (I think), she developed an interest in cute animals, and from that point became a vegetarian, and there was no issue on that. I favour the route of "Here's education on all the main religions" or zero education, a hole that would be filled by the education system (as it was for me), as opposed to pushing my, and only my, personal views upon them. Even if I were not to address the subject, that's not some sly attempt to make them atheist, but instead raises them on a kind of blank slate from where their own beliefs can blossom if they so desire. You have to understand the intent behind these things, rather than assuming (as another poster has) that my preferred method of education of religion is based in some bizarre atheist agenda.

What post anywhere in this thread said otherwise?

see this anger over nothing AGAIN

I'm "angry" over your complete and total disregard for having a real discussion for you to just shove bullshit into the discussion that no one ever said.

The end result is more or less the same. Without any pressed exposure to other ideas, your kids are naturally going to gravitate toward your beliefs whether you like it or not. It's not as if I'm going to find a babysitter to watch my kids while I go to mass on Sundays just to ensure they don't get forced. I think you're misunderstanding "raising my children X way" with "forcing them strictly to believe this and keep them from anything else".

"They also don't have the right to tell him what he can't eat. If he wants to eat meat, so be it."

That is not what you said, nor what you implied, nor is that statement of any moral contention what so ever.

the anger towards veganism is real though and it blinds the much more important issue

So you're taking that one, exceptionally broad and vague statement, to be akin of multiple people in the thread saying kids should be force fed McDonald's if that is what the kid begs for? I think you looked far, far too deeply into that post.

This is all some of the most disingenuous shit i've ever seen on Facepunch, and I argued with Tudd.

Probably out there in the world, there is a real anger toward veganism. But it's not here in this thread.

"I SHOULD BE ABLE TO LIE ABOUT THIS AS MUCH AS I WANT" I just keep re-reading this and honestly, this is what you're truly saying.

No? Not imposing your own beliefs on them is not even remotely close to raising them to be indifferent to anything? What a dumb false dichotomy. Most kids will adopt some of your ideology through mimicry, even if you strive to present your beliefs in an unbiased way. You're acting as if you don't impose your own ideology on them they're going to turn out as some sort of ideal-less individual, which is ridiculous. There's a significant difference between giving your kids the freedom to develop their own belief system by painting a fair picture of their options, even if they end up copying most of yours because they look up to you, and voluntarily imposing your own biased beliefs on them because "they're my kids and I can raise them however I like". If you truly believe that the latter option is preferable, then that's honestly concerning.

ok i mis-posted with the mcdonalds but it's still a non-issue if the child is healthy

We live in a world where religion is everywhere. It's baked into the idioms people use on a daily basis. I use phrases like "For God's sake" and I've been an atheist for over 15 years. The concept of religion will be brought up quite early. From an Irish perspective the vast majority of schools in Ireland are run by religious groups, mostly Catholic schools, and there are a lot of African immigrants in Dublin, many of whom are Muslim. The idea that me being an atheist would mean my child would have no exposure to religion is laughable, if anything my child would probably assume I'm Catholic just based on everyone else around if I never talked about religion. You're also assuming my partner would be an atheist, and let me tell you that being a requirement around here would make even having a relationship to have a kid practically impossible. Most people here are Catholic at least in name.

The news article in the OP is literally about kids not being healthy. In fact the first post in the thread almost says this word for word that it's not an issue if the kid is healthy.

People not to stop saying "let the child decide to go vegan at a later age", as if meat eating is some kind of objective default. Both are decisions. "Let the child decide to eat meat at a later age" is equally valid

meatism is also real also all those posts bar the mcdonalds weren't personally attacking anyone.

Honestly, you need to read what people actually say rather than cram their mouths full of things you wish they said so you could justify the anger and rage you displayed in this thread. You made at least 8 statements that were totally, 100% false that you claim were or are view points held by the people you're talking with. You know what people in this thread were actually angry about? You lying, and not reading shit.

Lmao it goes to show how much bad faith you're really harboring in this discussion if you're trying to make it all about the child's choice, ignoring the much more obvious and harsh reality that the parents aren't giving them much of a choice to begin with.

They're not attacking anyone, sure, but they're also wildly and intentionally misrepresenting the entirety of peoples views. That's just as bad. Meatism is almost a non existant meme and it's a joke for you to act like that justifies your total mis-characterization of the argument.

but subconsciously it is though.