Parents who raise children as vegans should be prosecuted, say Belgian doctors - Sensationalist Headlines

Veganism is not under attack. Kids shouldn't be on a strict vegan diet because they're in a phase of their lives where they need the extra bio available protein that plants do not provide them. No one is attacking veganism just because an article demonstrates a reality of the situation. If there was an article about how a child was sick from a meat only diet, do you think we'd be doing what you're doing, and representing your points in bad faith with no effort to read what was actually said? I don't think so. We'd all condemn the parents who hurt their child like that. Just as we do here. Seperate yourself from your ideology for a second god damn this is a child we're talking about and most of the responses you've had so far have been to completely lie about what we think

You a mind reader now? Oh no, not the "a lot of people". I hate those people. Especially when they're clearly not visible anywhere in this thread.

why do i have to name specific people i have met who are like this

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/pregnancy-and-baby/vegetarian-vegan-children/ The NHS says otherwise. Even as a child, you can easily get everything you need from a vegan diet.

what do you mean by we this is not a team sport of meat-eaters vs. vegans. I'm not even vegan but I still care when it is implied veganism is child abuse without true evidence to support that. the matter in the article is about non-education when it concerns balanced diets. it doesn't say "it is impossible" to meet the criteria for a growing child.

Actually, your link says they can get most and might still need supplements because foods that may usually contain sources of Vitamin B12 (e.g. milk alternatives) don't always contain it (it also discusses Iodine and Omega-3). Not commenting on the actual meat v vegan debate, just saying that even the NHS is like 'ehhh, it's more complicated than that'.

children should be having supplements anyway, no argument with that.

might need specific supplements in addition to the usual vitamin supplements recommended for all babies c'mon, there's no "need" and clearly there's no problem with giving children supplements in the first place, so that point wouldn't matter either way

By your arguement, just not going to a religious facility is taking away the child's option to explore.

We've already established that there's a difference between taking a route of indifference vs forcing a child away from religious 'facilities' due to a kind of underlying atheist agenda. They're not the same thing, and I've made it clear that I would try to, at the other side of the scale, introduce my hypothetical child to all possible routes and let them make their mind up no matter what trivialities their decision-making process is based on.

You want to make a claim, then back it up. You want to imply there's a good portion of people out there that are not just anti-vegan, but very "pro-meat", you need to prove it. Naming specific people you met is also not good enough. Provide a link, a study, a poll, anything that shows your fears of large numbers of meat eaters are not just anti-vegan, but "pro meat" and everyone here will believe you - that they exist. But then you still have to back up your claims that these kinds of people are actively posting in this thread.

I can't help but feel like this sort of decision should be up to them, not their parents...

Depending on the age it’s too young to make that sort of decision while properly taking everything into account. It’s pretty normal for parents to feed their kids when they’re younger.

HumanAbyss's post literally said that the plants can't provide them. And no, there's no reason why veganism becomes "very difficult", it's not like plants have a scarce amount of nutrients in them - as the link says, a well-planned diet is fine, same as a well-planned omni diet. You're gonna have to back up what you're saying if you think plants are this bad at feeding children.

There are differences in the nutrients found in animals and plants. Iron for example is a huge point where vegans and vegetarians can have issues because the body absorbs the iron from animals (heme iron) far more easily than the iron from plants (non-heme iron). Spinach is recommended to for people because it has a lot of iron (3.6mg per 100g), but you actually get less iron from spinach than you would from chicken despite chicken having far less iron in it (1.3mg per 100g). If a vegetarian looked at the nutritional information of spinach and compared it to that of chicken they'd naturally assume the spinach will give them more iron and be even better than chicken, but unfortunately because of how our bodies work his isn't the case. They should still eat spinach because it's very good for you (and is pretty good IMO) but they can't just assume the nutrients you get from vegetables are the same as those you get from meat.

A strict vegan diet. Again, if you're going to say it can supply all of the necessary nutrients, you need to be specific as to how much you're eating at that age. Kids need heightened amounts of phosphorus and potassium to encourage bone growth, they need lots of protein to continue growing every other part of their bodies. To get that amount of protein purely from plant sources is difficult under a strict diet, and requires as EmperorScorpious pointed out to you already, eating a vast quantity of food in comparison. Vegan diets are possible, but something I don't see people disputing is the concept of "Bio-availability" in our food sources. Plants provide proteins, yes, but they do so with less ease to our systems. Unlike ungulates, we only have one digestive stage to break down, and two stages to absorb. This leads to the difference in availability of the proteins provided in plants. Meat, specifically cooked meats, provide a much much higher level of protein to the body due to the ease at which it is available in the food. It is almost all proteins that the body naturally and easily digests and moves towards the growth or repair sites requires. Plant matter does have proteins, but due to the limited nature of our stomachs and digestive tracts in general, at an early age especially, it is hard if not impossible to consume a fully balanced diet without supplements. But again, supplements are not a good thing. They should not be relied upon, I understand doctors and the medical industry have made it seem natural that they be so, but again it comes down to bio-availability. Supplements are not a natural way for our bodies to get those nutrients, and many of the commercially available products in the US or Canada that say they're a healthy way to get those vitamins and minerals aren't wrong, but they're missing the bigger picture. They can flood our systems with excess which our bodies merely dump out, or in some cases they can accumulate in softer tissues which doesn't cause direct health issues from what I recall from my readings on the subject, but doesn't bode well long term. Vitamins and minerals naturally found in our foods get into our systems more efficiently for this reason

Yes, that's part of the "well planned" bit, if you try to eat without any care for nutrients you can easily miss stuff but that's very different to being "very difficult" just because meat is a convenient source of various nutrients. As the various quoted organisations say it's perfectly fine for a child to grow up on a vegan diet, most of the difficulty seems to come from being used to the needs of an omnivore diet.

If you have a newborn or a young child, they need specific nutrients that are critical for their development. It is well documented that lack of proper nutrients and poor diet lead to problems in the future and malnourishment. If you put your child on a diet and they are not getting the things their fucking body needs you are doing it wrong - no if ands or butts. If you put a child on a vegan diet and they start becoming malnourished - you are fucking doing it wrong and are scum. I have no issue with people who want ethically sourced food and don't want to support certain practices, but when you have a young child your principles don't fucking matter. You have an obligation to make sure they're taking care of and receive the nutrients they need for development. It is full-blown retarded to expect a infant or child to be sustained by certain practices and not supplement critical nurishment. If you get to the point your child is malnourished you are a failure of a parent. We are omnivores for a reason - we can process and extract nutrients from animals and plants. There are things you cannot get strictly from meat and things you cannot get strictly from plants. Usually you have to use some form of supplementation. There is a reason that most doctors suggest a balance diet - it incorporates everything from grains, meats, oils, fruit and veggies.

After sitting here chastising people for how they would choose to eat/would try and have their kids eat, you whine about diet superiority I mean your posts have always been vapid bullshit I'm just surprised to see you wearing it so proudly

if children need supplements for any reason by and large that usually just means their diet sucks lmao, and diet cant be entirely replaced using supplements because our bodies are primarily tuned to absorbing shit easier from food. Also I should tell you, most supplements are usually in the form of multivitamins, which in most cases tend to be poorly absorbed as well as give you an excess of whatever's already in your diet, which has long term effects in terms of your health. This primarily wouldnt be an issue if helicopter parents, would essentially not give their children multiple doses of supplement for whatever reason. It won't kill them by any means unless they swallow entire bottles, but the symptoms dont feel good either.

Some are pointed to in the article y'know, including the NHS which I linked a few posts up. Point is, while it may be "easier" to become malnourished on a vegan diet due to how uncommon it is which affects education and resources, a child becoming malnourished on a vegan diet isn't a fault of the diet being vegan, as stated by the numerous organisations saying you can bring a child up on a vegan diet (and no nutrients being meat-only). Malnourishment is down to the person's specific diet, not whether the diet is vegan, omni, keto, whatever, if said diet can provide - which a vegan diet can.

My hope is nobody is listening to you

then it's a different argument if you suggest multivitamins are pointless. but in this day and age, when things are so easy to obtain, children's vitamins are important. regardless of the diet regime.

If you're feeding your child properly, and you aren't making up some quasi-politic-science diet up, they should get everything they need from their food. If you need supplemental vitamins to make up for a lacking diet, then fix the fucking diet. If you take supplemental vitamins despite getting everything in your diet, then you should reconsider why you're taking vitamins. Barring some medical condition that requires supplements, why?

because uhh.. it's not always possible/easy to get all the essentials even no matter what diet you approach. you cannot tell me every day you get enough vitamin D because it's a straight up lie.

Very curious how mankind managed to survive the centuries before corporations started advertising vitamins as necessary to a kid's diet.

Milk Cereals Fish Eggs Cheese ... The Sun You don't need oodles of vitamin D every day.

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/pregnancy-and-baby/vitamins-for-children/ NHS is such an evil corporation it must be stopped.

if you raise a young child or infant on a vegan diet that doesn't give them the important vitamins, minerals, nutrition, protein and energy they need to have a fun childhood, and grow up healthy any strong, you're abusing your child. that's undernourishment of a child. an adult body, that's already grown and developed, sure. but don't make your kid live that way, let them eat normal healthy foods and let them choose to eat vegan if they want to.

My 2 year old niece would inhale all that list. You sure you've raised kids before because you're talking a lot with ignorance.