Gamers harass woman online over Mass Effect Andromeda - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=Coffee;51984761]This whole thing just feels like it's a massive false flag operation to create more buzz for the game.[/QUOTE] "woman attacked for blatantly shit animations" isn't a headline any company wants for their game

[QUOTE=Dr.C;51984797]Is he even writing the game? I thought he just did the art. I know he did the art for Halo 4 so I guess people think that he's the reason Halo 4 sucks, therefore he's the reason ME:A sucks when it's just coincidence they both suck and he's worked on both[/QUOTE] I don't think he does, I think it was game design. Seen several posts on it, which is also why I put that perceived faults part in my first post. Doesn't matter whether something is true or not, if that's what was perceived, they'll attack you for it.

[QUOTE=Coffee;51984761]This whole thing just feels like it's a massive false flag operation to create more buzz for the game.[/QUOTE] Not really? I don't see how people being human garbage on twitter is something new or manufactured. This happens all the time naturally because even if one out of a thousand people are stupid enough to do this kind of crap, they got a hundred thousand that read the article.

[QUOTE=Cliff2;51984774]A lot of silence about Manveer Heir getting the same treatment. Though tbf he was a dick. The internet will tear down any fault(Whether real or perceived) it can find relentlessly. Articles like the ones above exist solely to manufacture controversy(and views) when the real problem is that the internet is a festering shithole that hates everyone.[/QUOTE] Manveer Heir is obviously enjoying his position as a target for harassment, the man sees himself as a sort of "brown crusader of social justice", and all the white cis males hating his guts on the internet just validate his perception of himself. Though, I'd rather see people ignore his bullshit, for several reasons (harassment is wrong, ignoring stupid people is the best way to get them to shut up, etc...)

Why is this news? Theres fucktons of people getting harassed and death threats on the internet, and they don't get to the news. Suddenly this becomes newsworthy because its a woman related to a game that was badly put together? For fuck sakes, anyone does exactly what the people who said the "she had to suck a dick to get to X" did. I've lost count of how many times I've heard that age old say about someone getting into a higher position after bending over for the boss, both for female and male individuals. But of fucking course, this had to be news because the "gamers are mysoginistic pigs" narrative has to be passed whenever possible.

[QUOTE=Coffee;51984761]This whole thing just feels like it's a massive false flag operation to create more buzz for the game.[/QUOTE] It's definitely not, unless they bought out ralph. He's just a terrible person.

Okay, as a woman who happens to be a gamer, I am sick of the media creaming themselves every time a woman gets the slightest amount of criticism. It's not helping. In fact, it infantilizes women, therefore dehumanizing us, therefore only continuing the cycle and making it worse. We can handle criticism. If male artists are held up to a standard, female artists should be held up to that standard as well. What happened to this particular person sucks. It does. I place the blame not with the particular person, but the upper management of these companies. They continuously fuck over not only the fans, but their own employees, so is this really all that unexpected? Some people--definitely not a large amount, but when you're given a virtual megaphone, any amount seems large--took it way too fucking far. Why? Because, again, the media creams themselves [I]every time[/I]. They give these harassers attention, which is what they thrive on. And because every media outlet bleats "harassment! harassment!" gaming is portrayed as dangerous. So as hard as these outlets like to pretend so many women play games, it's the media themselves driving women out of the industry. Why? Because we don't like being infantilized, we don't like being dehumanized, and, yes, we don't like random assholes being random assholes. Here's the kicker. I still call myself a gamer. Why? Because I fucking love video games. And you can't tell me to abandon my hobby because it's too dangerous for me. Again, that's infantilizing and completely ignores that I'm a grown-ass woman capable of critical thought and looking out for myself. I am completely sick of the gaming community getting thrown under the bus. Go ahead and check my join date. It's fucking 2005. Do you think I would still be on this forum if this wasn't the most welcoming, interesting community I've encountered? Do you think I would be on Discord nightly if there weren't awesome people to talk to, and awesome people watching my back? I've made so many friends here, and yeah, there's random assholes here too. But do you think the majority actually agree with that random asshole? They don't. Otherwise I wouldn't be here. TL;DR George Foreman grill rants about join date elitism.

[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;51984882]Why is this news? Theres fucktons of people getting harassed and death threats on the internet, and they don't get to the news. Suddenly this becomes newsworthy because its a woman related to a game that was badly put together? For fuck sakes, anyone does exactly what the people who said the "she had to suck a dick to get to X" did. I've lost count of how many times I've heard that age old say about someone getting into a higher position after bending over for the boss, both for female and male individuals. But of fucking course, this had to be news because the "gamers are mysoginistic pigs" narrative has to be passed whenever possible.[/QUOTE] On that note, here's a bit from the article that wasn't quoted in the OP: [quote]The attacks were reminiscent of the death and rape threats directed at women beginning in 2014 over the [url=]GamerGate controversy[/url], an online campaign against cultural critic [url=]Anita Sarkeesian[/url], of the [url=]Feminist Frequency[/url] Web series, and others for challenging the way women are portrayed in video games. Sakreesian was forced into hiding and canceled a speaking engagement at Utah State University after the school got emails threatening the "[url=]deadliest school shooting in American history[/url]" if she appeared.[/quote][link placement theirs] That probably clears up why exactly this incident is 'particularly newsworthy'.

[QUOTE=Rocâ„¢;51984882]Why is this news? Theres fucktons of people getting harassed and death threats on the internet, and they don't get to the news. Suddenly this becomes newsworthy because its a woman related to a game that was badly put together? For fuck sakes, anyone does exactly what the people who said the "she had to suck a dick to get to X" did. I've lost count of how many times I've heard that age old say about someone getting into a higher position after bending over for the boss, both for female and male individuals. But of fucking course, this had to be news because the "gamers are mysoginistic pigs" narrative has to be passed whenever possible.[/QUOTE] Uhh dude we're talking about someone who worked on a AAA game in a community of people that had a very long, bitter, and public internet meltdown which touched on issues of misogyny, harassment, and ethics. How is this not newsworthy?

[QUOTE=Dr.C;51984772]One of the problems with the harassment is that they're treating it like she herself is the reason the game has garbage animation, all the blame is on her. She's [B]not even[/B] the lead animator. The same thing happened with Dragon Age 2. People jumped on Hamburger Helper and blamed her for the game sucking when the writing of the game was just one of the many, many things wrong with the game and she wasn't even wholly responsible for that either. I can't say for sure it's because they're women but in both of these cases people were looking for a scapegoat[/QUOTE] hepler is single handedly responsible for Anders, Bethany, Gamlen, Leandra, Elthina, Cullen, and Sebastian Vael, which are all awful one dimensional angsty twilight shit and wrote the entirety of act 3 of da2, all of which were its objectively worst parts

Where was the narrative of "Movie watchers are misogynist woman hating scum" when Leslie Jones was harassed so hard she closed her twitter account?

[QUOTE=Helix Snake;51984939]Where was the narrative of "Movie watchers are misogynist woman hating scum" when Leslie Jones was harassed so hard she closed her twitter account?[/QUOTE] everywhere? [editline]20th March 2017[/editline] like leslie jones herself parroted the narrative

[QUOTE=Egevened;51984931]hepler is single handedly responsible for Anders, Bethany, Gamlen, Leandra, Elthina, Cullen, and Sebastian Vael, which are all awful one dimensional angsty twilight shit and wrote the entirety of act 3 of da2, all of which were its objectively worst parts[/QUOTE] She's also responsible for basically the entirety of dwarven culture in Dragon Age. She wrote the whole main dwarven questline in DA:O IIRC. [editline]19th March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Egevened;51984941]everywhere? [editline]20th March 2017[/editline] like leslie jones herself parroted the narrative[/QUOTE] did she? you got a source?

[QUOTE=Lambeth;51984945]She's also responsible for basically the entirety of dwarven culture in Dragon Age. She wrote the whole main dwarven questline in DA:O IIRC.[/QUOTE] which also happens to be by far the worst part of da:o, deep roads and origin story

[QUOTE=Egevened;51984941]everywhere? [editline]20th March 2017[/editline] like leslie jones herself parroted the narrative[/QUOTE] Technically it was 'the critics of this movie are all white men and are racist sexist garbage', though, which is very different. Sony had been cooking that one for months in advance, too.

[QUOTE=Lambeth;51984945]She's also responsible for basically the entirety of dwarven culture in Dragon Age. She wrote the whole main dwarven questline in DA:O IIRC. [editline]19th March 2017[/editline] did she? you got a source?[/QUOTE] [url]http://www.ebony.com/news-views/leslie-jones-colorism#axzz4bpMmPP2o[/url] [url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/amy-arndt/hey-white-people-we-need-_b_11705818.html[/url] [url]http://femfreq.tumblr.com/post/147658217495/what-happened-to-leslie-jones-is-simply[/url] [video=youtube;5KxhU_yZLG8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KxhU_yZLG8[/video]

[QUOTE=Penultimate;51984900]Okay, as a woman who happens to be a gamer, I am sick of the media creaming themselves every time a woman gets the slightest amount of criticism. It's not helping. In fact, it infantilizes women, therefore dehumanizing us, therefore only continuing the cycle and making it worse. We can handle criticism. If male artists are held up to a standard, female artists should be held up to that standard as well. What happened to this particular person sucks. It does. I place the blame not with the particular person, but the upper management of these companies. They continuously fuck over not only the fans, but their own employees, so is this really all that unexpected? Some people--definitely not a large amount, but when you're given a virtual megaphone, any amount seems large--took it way too fucking far. Why? Because, again, the media creams themselves [I]every time[/I]. They give these harassers attention, which is what they thrive on. And because every media outlet bleats "harassment! harassment!" gaming is portrayed as dangerous. So as hard as these outlets like to pretend so many women play games, it's the media themselves driving women out of the industry. Why? Because we don't like being infantilized, we don't like being dehumanized, and, yes, we don't like random assholes being random assholes. Here's the kicker. I still call myself a gamer. Why? Because I fucking love video games. And you can't tell me to abandon my hobby because it's too dangerous for me. Again, that's infantilizing and completely ignores that I'm a grown-ass woman capable of critical thought and looking out for myself. I am completely sick of the gaming community getting thrown under the bus. Go ahead and check my join date. It's fucking 2005. Do you think I would still be on this forum if this wasn't the most welcoming, interesting community I've encountered? Do you think I would be on Discord nightly if there weren't awesome people to talk to, and awesome people watching my back? I've made so many friends here, and yeah, there's random assholes here too. But do you think the majority actually agree with that random asshole? They don't. Otherwise I wouldn't be here. TL;DR George Foreman grill rants about join date elitism.[/QUOTE] Gamer misogyny has been a trending topic for over half a decade now. A title that starts with "Gamers harass woman..." is going to get a lot of clicks, and that's why they do it, it's pretty obvious. But that's just half of the problem. The reason that these articles are being written is because people actually get harassed. Internet death threats are bullshit, but they do make people uncomfortable. And with things like doxxing and swatting and whatever, it can leak into peoples' real lives. Criticism should be way more civil than it is now, and the internet can't seem to criticize anyone without threatening to murder their entire family for some reason. People need to get a grip.

[QUOTE=Egevened;51984950]which also happens to be by far the worst part of da:o, deep roads and origin story[/QUOTE] I really liked it but hey different strokes. The weakest origin is Wood Elf. :disgust:

of course its all tabloid garbage but the narrative is there was meant to be a merge

[QUOTE=Egevened;51984941]everywhere? [editline]20th March 2017[/editline] like leslie jones herself parroted the narrative[/QUOTE] I mean movie watchers as a whole, not just people who didn't like the new Ghostbusters

[QUOTE=Helix Snake;51984965]I mean movie watchers as a whole, not just people who didn't like the new Ghostbusters[/QUOTE] okay? do video game players as a whole make sexist remarks around the clock

[QUOTE=Egevened;51984966]okay? do video game players as a whole make sexist remarks around the clock[/QUOTE] We're being generalised as such [I]a lot[/I].

[QUOTE=Waffle cones.;51984972]yes[/QUOTE] so everyone here has done that then is what you're saying you and people like you are why dialogue on the internet is either a screaming fest, or a sarcastic extremes to extremes arguement

[QUOTE=Penultimate;51984900]Okay, as a woman who happens to be a gamer, I am sick of the media creaming themselves every time a woman gets the slightest amount of criticism. It's not helping. In fact, it infantilizes women, therefore dehumanizing us, therefore only continuing the cycle and making it worse. We can handle criticism. If male artists are held up to a standard, female artists should be held up to that standard as well. What happened to this particular person sucks. It does. I place the blame not with the particular person, but the upper management of these companies. They continuously fuck over not only the fans, but their own employees, so is this really all that unexpected? Some people--definitely not a large amount, but when you're given a virtual megaphone, any amount seems large--took it way too fucking far. Why? Because, again, the media creams themselves every time. They give these harassers attention, which is what they thrive on. And because every media outlet bleats "harassment! harassment!" gaming is portrayed as dangerous. So as hard as these outlets like to pretend so many women play games, it's the media themselves driving women out of the industry. Why? Because we don't like being infantilized, we don't like being dehumanized, and, yes, we don't like random assholes being random assholes. Here's the kicker. I still call myself a gamer. Why? Because I fucking love video games. And you can't tell me to abandon my hobby because it's too dangerous for me. Again, that's infantilizing and completely ignores that I'm a grown-ass woman capable of critical thought and looking out for myself. I am completely sick of the gaming community getting thrown under the bus. Go ahead and check my join date. It's fucking 2005. Do you think I would still be on this forum if this wasn't the most welcoming, interesting community I've encountered? Do you think I would be on Discord nightly if there weren't awesome people to talk to, and awesome people watching my back? I've made so many friends here, and yeah, there's random assholes here too. But do you think the majority actually agree with that random asshole? They don't. Otherwise I wouldn't be here.[/QUOTE] I'm reading all this and it sounds like you're referring to the darker corners of game journalism, something that does not represent the entirety of mainstream media nor the entirety of games journalism. The whole giving idiots microphone things also applies to the general media; While many outlets will simply report "Lead Animator of Mass Effect Gets Death Threats", the outlets that people seem to give too much attention to, aka the ones that run the garbage you mentioned, report on it. [editline]4[/editline] Like you mention "every time a woman gets the slightest amount of criticism", in this case, this isn't slight criticism. These are death/rape threats. Death/Rape threats aren't criticism. This isn't your typical gamergate story.

[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51984987]Death/Rape threats aren't criticism.[/QUOTE]Was that every one of, a majority of, or anything close to the majority of the comments about or towards her?

[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51984987]Death/Rape threats aren't criticism.[/QUOTE] Yeah, but they're also conflated all the time. So for every threat a woman seems to get, she gets a ton more criticism, right? And it's only the threat people report on, making it seem like all of the attention is threats. Again, problems with journalism, not problems with people having problems with death/rape threats. Also, are we going to make a distinction between random words on the internet versus credible threats? I don't really want to, if only because I think heinous words are heinous words and you can't really determine whether something's credible unless something happens. [QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51984987]I'm reading all this and it sounds like you're referring to the darker corners of game journalism, something that does not represent the entirety of mainstream media nor the entirety of games journalism. The whole giving idiots microphone things also applies to the general media; While many outlets will simply report "Lead Animator of Mass Effect Gets Death Threats", the outlets that people seem to give too much attention to, aka the ones that run the garbage you mentioned, report on it.[/QUOTE] Very good point. I just don't think there's many good outlets right now. I've lost a lot of faith in journalism in general, though I'm still holding out some hope.

[QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;51985002]Was that every one of, a majority of, or anything close to the majority of the comments about or towards her?[/QUOTE] If you think that I believe that the majority of comments directed at her were threats of death or criticism then you're dead wrong.

[QUOTE=ROFLBURGER;51985035]If you think that I believe that the majority of comments directed at her were threats of death or criticism then you're dead wrong.[/QUOTE]Mm, should learn how to make your point better then. Because you're saying they all are. You're actively denying there is any criticism. [quote]this isn't slight criticism. These are death/rape threats.[/quote] There is nothing there about "some" or anything. Its absolute. "These are death/rape threats." Nothing else.

[QUOTE=Egevened;51984959][url]http://www.ebony.com/news-views/leslie-jones-colorism#axzz4bpMmPP2o[/url] [/QUOTE] This appears to be an opinion piece criticizing Jones (and the black community) for falling into the same tired old racist sterotypes. [QUOTE=Egevened;51984959][url]http://www.huffingtonpost.com/amy-arndt/hey-white-people-we-need-_b_11705818.html[/url] [/QUOTE] This is a blog post about a woman expressing solidarity for Leslie Jones in the face of the latter's harassment. [QUOTE=Egevened;51984959][url]http://femfreq.tumblr.com/post/147658217495/what-happened-to-leslie-jones-is-simply[/url][/QUOTE] This is Fem Freq and Leslie Jones criticizing twitter for their piss poor attempts at preventing and managing abuse. [QUOTE=Egevened;51984959][video=youtube;5KxhU_yZLG8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KxhU_yZLG8[/video][/QUOTE] This is a harmless video with Leslie talking about her experience with twitter trolls? Not really seeing a "movie watchers are mysogynist woman hating scum" narrative being established here.

[QUOTE=Penultimate;51985029]Yeah, but they're also conflated all the time. So for every threat a woman seems to get, she gets a ton more criticism, right? And it's only the threat people report on, making it seem like all of the attention is threats. Again, problems with journalism, not problems with people having problems with death/rape threats. Also, are we going to make a distinction between random words on the internet versus credible threats? I don't really want to, if only because I think heinous words are heinous words and you can't really determine whether something's credible unless something happens.[/quote] You pretty much hit the nail on the head when it comes to the flaws of journalism. A lot of people seem to think that the more the press reports on something, the more common it is. The press only report on stories that are "engaging" aka get the most clicks and whatnot. They're not going to report "Game developer got a bunch of positive messages about his game" because that doesn't earn them money. They will, however, report "GAME DEVELOPER GETS DEATH THREATS" because it's a much more engaging story. It needs to be taught that just because you commonly see it in the news, doesn't mean it's common. [editline]19th March 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Doctor Zedacon;51985045]Mm, should learn how to make your point better then. Because you're saying they all are. You're actively denying there is any criticism. There is nothing there about "some" or anything. Its absolute. "These are death/rape threats." Nothing else.[/QUOTE] I was referring to what was being reported. See, this is a double edged sword because you could've just asked for clarification instead of assuming the worst and least likely (almost impossible, tbh) thing out of all the things I've could've been talking about.