no reveal of the final car, just gonna start releasing them? OK i guess but they still haven't really given any reason not to have an instrument cluster
Physical buttons > touch screens imo
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;52428876]I hate the lack of physical buttons. Something as basic as changing the volume shouldn't be so risky.[/QUOTE]
The steering wheel things probably control volume and stuff too. Like any halfway decent new car.
[editline]3rd July 2017[/editline]
Hell, my 10 year old Silverado has basic controls on the wheel.
[QUOTE=Trekintosh;52428876]I hate the lack of physical buttons. Something as basic as changing the volume shouldn't be so risky.[/QUOTE]
That's what the scroll wheels on the steering wheel are for. They can be set to fan speed, volume, whatever on the S and X - I imagine it'll be the same in the 3. A screen in place of physical controls is akin to the movement away from keyboards to touch screens on phones. They can be customized, updated, and are capable of much more interaction. Would you all still prefer to be using smartphones where most of the interaction interface was buttons?
[QUOTE=Supacasey;52429018]That's what the scroll wheels on the steering wheel are for. They can be set to fan speed, volume, whatever on the S and X - I imagine it'll be the same in the 3. A screen in place of physical controls is akin to the movement away from keyboards to touch screens on phones. They can be customized, updated, and are capable of much more interaction. Would you all still prefer to be using smartphones where most of the interaction interface was buttons?[/QUOTE]
I would if I expected much of my interaction to be done without looking at the screen. Even the best touch screens are horribly imprecise compared to knobs and physical buttons. I'm not saying touch screens are bad, I'm saying I don't like them doing everything. Would [I]you[/I] prefer a smartphone with no physical volume rocker/buttons? If the volume slider/button/spinner isn't always visible, then you'll probably need to use gesture controls, like on some smartphone video players, which are horribly imprecise. Either that or you'll need to press a button to show volume controls, which is even worse.
Touch screens shouldn't be for absolutely everything. Especially not things you'll be adjusting often while driving. There's nothing wrong with having both buttons and touch screens. Unless the reason most people are against it is Elon's "vision" or something, which means you're putting aesthetics over function and safety.
This isn't an all or none situation. Like I said the knobs on the wheel are for frequently used controls, the screen is for stuff you'd temporarily look away for anyway like navigation or a backup camera. The S and X also have two buttons adjacent to each knob for initiating a voice command, skipping songs, and changing music stations that are also programmable. I don't see them in the 3 but I would imagine the release version would likely have them.
[QUOTE=Supacasey;52429018] Would you all still prefer to be using smartphones where most of the interaction interface was buttons?[/QUOTE]
Except you're always looking at the screen when you're using the phone, in a car you should be looking at the road while driving, unless you're only using autopilot which I'm pretty sure can't drive you from start to finish by itself just yet. I can adjust 3 AC knobs, radio volume and skip songs without taking a single glance at them and I don't think the scroll wheels can cover all of that
[editline]a[/editline]
Also I still hate how the interior looks, even ignoring the lack of the dashboard the huge screen looks more like some shitty iPad holder rather than a part of the car like in the model S or X
[QUOTE=Thunderbolt;52429108]Except you're always looking at the screen when you're using the phone, in a car you should be looking at the road while driving, unless you're only using autopilot which I'm pretty sure can't drive you from start to finish by itself just yet. I can adjust 3 AC knobs, radio volume and skip songs without taking a single glance at them and I don't think the scroll wheels can cover all of that[/QUOTE]
You don't even have to look since they are always in the same place. The two knobs can likely do all that as well.
The lack of official interior shots tells me it's still shit and they know it
[QUOTE=Thunderbolt;52429108]I can adjust 3 AC knobs, radio volume and skip songs without taking a single glance at them and I don't think the scroll wheels can cover all of that[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=Supacasey;52429104]The S and X also have two buttons adjacent to each knob for initiating a voice command, skipping songs, and changing music stations that are also programmable.[/QUOTE]
:terrists:
[QUOTE=Supacasey;52429163]:terrists:[/QUOTE]
You posted that while I was still writing my post and I didn't see it, oh well
[QUOTE=thrawn2787;52429138]The lack of official interior shots tells me it's still shit and they know it[/QUOTE]
They haven't show off anything since the unveil, not even the changes to the exterior. Last month they had a VIP event to show the Model 3 to some people and they brought out the alpha prototypes despite having test mules around with the changes.
They have made substantial improvements to the interior though since the unveiling.
Alpha:
[t]https://static.autoblog.nl/images/wp2017/model-3-interieur-31.jpg[/t]
Test mules:
[t]http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/11/2017/06/2018-Tesla-Model-3-Interior-via-Imgur.jpg[/t]
It's still too barebone. I will wait for a better version.
From someone that works at a big 3 Tech Company in Silicon Valley; All of my friends at major tech companies who are normally on board the Musk/Tesla hype train as much as Morgen is think this design is an awful decision.
How much more expensive is it to add a speedometer/basic dashboard?
[QUOTE=eirexe;52426903]I hope you can truly disable traction control on this one without pulling the fuse[/QUOTE]
To do this on most cars you have to pull the ABS fuse. I did this when I rented a Charger because it wouldn't let you fully turn off the granny aids. You lose ABS, but as long as you're not a panic braker, it's not a problem. ABS is actually hindering to straight line stopping in a hard braking scenario, but it's good for panic braking. You have to know your car pretty damn well to avoid locking the tires.
[QUOTE=Amplar;52433872]To do this on most cars you have to pull the ABS fuse. I did this when I rented a Charger because it wouldn't let you fully turn off the granny aids. You lose ABS, but as long as you're not a panic braker, it's not a problem. ABS is actually hindering to straight line stopping in a hard braking scenario, but it's good for panic braking. You have to know your car pretty damn well to avoid locking the tires.[/QUOTE]
Are you a driving instructor/expert to make such stupid claims ?
Uh, where the fuck are the gauges? Do they seriously expect me to look that far away from the road to see my speed?
[QUOTE=Itsjustguy;52434231]Are you a driving instructor/expert to make such stupid claims ?[/QUOTE]
It's not a stupid claim. It's the truth. ABS is in place to prevent the 99% of drivers on the road who aren't familiar enough with their vehicle to know how to threshold brake from locking up and sliding into another vehicle any time they slightly misjudge a braking distance. The maximum braking force is achieved when the tire's slip rate is about 12% with regards to the ground, this means that the tire is still rotating, but slightly sliding along the surface of the road. The difference between threshold braking and complete lock-up is slight, however, and when the wheels are locked you lose a lot of braking force. That's why ABS is there. Because in a panic braking situation, the average driver isn't going to think 'oh I need to threshold brake and slow down optimally', they're just going to nuke the brake pedal and if it wasn't for ABS they would lock up and slide into whatever they're pointed at, or even worse, spin.
Source: physics, racing license
[QUOTE=Zombii;52434298]It's not a stupid claim. It's the truth. ABS is in place to prevent the 99% of drivers on the road who aren't familiar enough with their vehicle to know how to threshold brake from locking up and sliding into another vehicle any time they slightly misjudge a braking distance. The maximum braking force is achieved when the tire's slip rate is about 12% with regards to the ground, this means that the tire is still rotating, but slightly sliding along the surface of the road. The difference between threshold braking and complete lock-up is slight, however, and when the wheels are locked you lose a lot of braking force. That's why ABS is there. Because in a panic braking situation, the average driver isn't going to think 'oh I need to threshold brake and slow down optimally', they're just going to nuke the brake pedal and if it wasn't for ABS they would lock up and slide into whatever they're pointed at, or even worse, spin.
Source: physics, racing license[/QUOTE]
Fairly sure modern ABS doesn't hinder in any way. It's the same as with automatic gearboxes. Modern ones are just as fast as manuals.
[QUOTE=joost1120;52434356]Fairly sure modern ABS doesn't hinder in any way. It's the same as with automatic gearboxes. Modern ones are just as fast as manuals.[/QUOTE]
It doesn't hinder it. What I'm saying is that when ABS activates, it is not magically better at braking than it was before it activated. I guess I should have read the original post a little better. For some reason I thought it was being implied that 100% pedal application in ABS was more effective than threshold braking. What I'm saying is something like this:
[t]http://horobox.co.uk/u/RnDwUh.png[/t]
Basically, they're equal up until lock-up, which is where ABS comes on and saves people from sliding around on locked wheels.
Some older or particularly aggressive ABS systems do hinder braking if you know what you're doing though, because they either misinterpret the braking input and assume panic braking even when the wheels wouldn't be locking up and ABS kicks in, or they try to overly 'predict' braking input and see someone mash the brake right up to the threshold of braking and then ABS kicks in because it assumes that you're going to continue mashing until the wheels lock. Most modern systems are not hindering to the driver at all, assuming they aren't going over the limit. ABS has been shown however to be less effective at braking than without it on surfaces like gravel, ice, dirt, and sand though.
Not like ABS is even engaged when braking normally, what the hell?
Edit: didn't see last post
[QUOTE=dustyjo;52434237]Uh, where the fuck are the gauges? Do they seriously expect me to look that far away from the road to see my speed?[/QUOTE]
It's at the top left of the screen and is still in your peripheral vision, it will be next to your right hand. Many other cars have done this without issue.
[QUOTE=Morgen;52430458]They haven't show off anything since the unveil, not even the changes to the exterior. Last month they had a VIP event to show the Model 3 to some people and they brought out the alpha prototypes despite having test mules around with the changes.
They have made substantial improvements to the interior though since the unveiling.
Alpha:
[t]https://static.autoblog.nl/images/wp2017/model-3-interieur-31.jpg[/t]
Test mules:
[t]http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sites/11/2017/06/2018-Tesla-Model-3-Interior-via-Imgur.jpg[/t][/QUOTE]
The bottom picture doesn't look bad at all
[editline]5th July 2017[/editline]
[QUOTE=dustyjo;52434237]Uh, where the fuck are the gauges? Do they seriously expect me to look that far away from the road to see my speed?[/QUOTE]
The touch screen is positioned in a way so you'll always see your speed in your vision
The interior looks fine in my opinion, even if no gauges is a little silly. But those little knobbies on the steering wheel are egregiously ugly to me.
[QUOTE=Zombii;52434395]It doesn't hinder it. What I'm saying is that when ABS activates, it is not magically better at braking than it was before it activated. I guess I should have read the original post a little better. For some reason I thought it was being implied that 100% pedal application in ABS was more effective than threshold braking. What I'm saying is something like this:
[t]http://horobox.co.uk/u/RnDwUh.png[/t]
Basically, they're equal up until lock-up, which is where ABS comes on and saves people from sliding around on locked wheels.
Some older or particularly aggressive ABS systems do hinder braking if you know what you're doing though, because they either misinterpret the braking input and assume panic braking even when the wheels wouldn't be locking up and ABS kicks in, or they try to overly 'predict' braking input and see someone mash the brake right up to the threshold of braking and then ABS kicks in because it assumes that you're going to continue mashing until the wheels lock. Most modern systems are not hindering to the driver at all, assuming they aren't going over the limit. ABS has been shown however to be less effective at braking than without it on surfaces like gravel, ice, dirt, and sand though.[/QUOTE]
The biggest misconception with ABS is that its there to reduce braking distance. It sometimes does, but like you point out, not always. Its primary function is to make sure you still have control of the car by keeping the wheels moving.
Wish the dash tablet thing was a bit more embeded
God I want one.
Going to finish this tafe course and get good at clinical coding.. the pay is good enough to get this outright in a year. Hopefully will be driving one by this time 2019.
Elon tweeted some pics of the first Model 3 off the line
[media]https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/883900030163324930[/media]
[media]https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/883910005644251141[/media]
Lookin' good
[QUOTE=Morgen;52430458]
They have made substantial improvements to the interior though since the unveiling.
[/QUOTE]
What's the difference? All I can see is they made everything black and added what looks like an air vent.
The interior looks like any other luxury car. I dunno why everyone's going "ooooh it's sooooo ugly"
It's fucking [I]sleek[/I]. A hard instrument cluster would be nice, but it's not a dealbreaker for me.
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