Mass Shooting in Las Vegas - 58 Dead at Least 515 Injured, Suspect Killed - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=wauterboi;52739311]The lines are getting insanely long here in Vegas. According to my mom, people are being asked to make appointments instead because it's got something to do with blood going bad? I don't really know what this means, but I tried to give blood earlier this morning to an American Red Cross that wasn't accepting blood until tomorrow. Weird.[/QUOTE] Well you don't buy more milk if you don't have space in your fridge to keep it do you?

Hey guy so if it only takes us what, 20 hours, to start the invitable fruitless gun discussion maybe we could take the sensible approach and talk about how to phase out the weird fetish culture that the US developed through it's history instead of flat banning. Just... you know.. an approach that would work in the real world. Where gun nuts wouldn't have to give away their beloved guns but maybe their kids are a bit different.

[QUOTE=Morgen;52739303]Something like a gun should be a privilege. Something that is capable of this kind of thing should be something you have to prove you understand, and prove you are fit to use it. It's not a bloody toy. Sure illegal firearms will always be a thing but it's not an all or nothing thing. If you make it much harder for people to get them, then you will see a lot less events like this, and more than likely lower death tolls.[/QUOTE] This has been beaten to death. Americans keep guns as a check on our own government. That makes the government categorically unfit to determine that firearms are a privilege. [B]We accept the additional risk that comes from this. [/B] Part of being American is accepting some measure of increased risk in return for additional freedoms. We certainly forget ourselves sometimes, but it is one of the fundamental underlying principles of who we are.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;52739316]Well you don't buy more milk if you don't have space in your fridge to keep it do you?[/QUOTE] That's what I figured it was. But it still seemed kind of shocking to me.

[QUOTE=GunFox;52739300]Yeah, just turn over your guns and trust the federal government. Currently run by Trump. No thanks.[/QUOTE] I am seeing fellow liberals all on Facebook with this shit. I hate to be that guy, but they are shooting themselves in the foots. I am seeing much more level headiness here than there.

[QUOTE=butre;52739152]the thing is, lawmakers don't have any better ideas than you or I do. we're all thinking with human brains, only difference is that lawmakers are better at wording things in absolute terms.[/QUOTE] what? do job qualifications and experience suddenly cease to exist when it helps your argument?

[QUOTE=Pascall;52739313]I'm not arguing that, I'm just saying that there are probably many ideas that are either being stifled, not making it into hearing range, or just haven't gained enough traction to be noticed. To say that lawmakers don't have any better ideas is more than likely untrue.[/QUOTE] well I gotta say they haven't proven themselves to have any better ideas.

[QUOTE=Pascall;52739296]That seems like a silly statement to make. I'm sure there are proposals coming from many different avenues with different ideas from people who have experience and are much better educated on these situations than I am. Otherwise they probably shouldn't be lawmakers?[/QUOTE] lawmakers are retarded when it comes to gun laws and they fall for scare tactics, don't believe in them too much for example this [IMG]https://thenypost.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/16n_rifles_ipad-525x300.jpg[/IMG] nothing really different other than some scary accessories are not allowed, the gun still works about the same as it did before the law was passed

[QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;52739307]No shit they shouldn't be lawmakers, thats the point. Lawmakers form and vote on legislation over things they know very little or nothing about. Theres an entire series of videos from ban states where legislators are describing gun legislation and they know absolutely nothing about the subject.[/QUOTE] Read my last post. Of course there are underqualified individuals, but that's not really what I was talking about.

[QUOTE=-nesto-;52739312]The reaction to this shooting is disturbing(not here obviously). Richard Dawkins mocking the dead. A CBS exec got fired for hoping most of the country music crowd were Trump supporters. Tons of people making this a race thing and celebrating the deaths of white people. And ofcourse the poltards playing FBI and calling this another false flag like Sandy Hook. Fuck is wrong with people.[/QUOTE] Hopped onto a chatroom I used to visit more regularly only to find people trying to link the shooter to anti-Trump supporters or calling it a false flag.

[QUOTE=wauterboi;52739311]The lines are getting insanely long here in Vegas. According to my mom, people are being asked to make appointments instead because it's got something to do with blood going bad? I don't really know what this means, but I tried to give blood earlier this morning to an American Red Cross that wasn't accepting blood until tomorrow. Weird. Interestingly enough, I showed up with a couple tourists who literally took a taxi from their hotel down to donate blood. That's cool - I believe they took a taxi to another place that donated blood.[/QUOTE] I think blood has to be processed quickly, or it does go bad. Once it has been processed, it is a little more stable. Obviously they can't expand with the increase in supply, which is understandable.

[QUOTE=Morgen;52739303]Something like a gun should be a privilege. Something that is capable of this kind of thing should be something you have to prove you understand, and prove you are fit to use it. It's not a bloody toy. Sure illegal firearms will always be a thing but it's not an all or nothing thing. If you make it much harder for people to get them, then you will see a lot less events like this, and more than likely lower death tolls.[/QUOTE] You are aware it's an [I]explicit [/I]right to keep firearms in this country correct? The second you get rid of that it makes the path to disarming the citizenry that much easier. I get that that's probably your ideal way to deal with the situation, but it will most certainly never fly in the US.

[QUOTE=Killuah;52739317]Hey guy so if it only takes us what, 20 hours, to start the invitable fruitless gun discussion maybe we could take the sensible approach and talk about how to phase out the weird fetish culture that the US developed through it's history instead of flat banning. Just... you know.. an approach that would work in the real world. Where gun nuts wouldn't have to give away their beloved guns but maybe their kids are a bit different.[/QUOTE] I always find it interesting that people can very definitively say that US gun culture is "fetish culture" despite only seeing a handful of internet memes and facebook quality videos on the subject. Or if you've done more research on the subject than I'm assuming, and you think people enjoying firearms like one would enjoy cars or airplanes is "fetish culture", then theres nothing I can say to that.

[QUOTE=GunFox;52739318]This has been beaten to death. Americans keep guns as a check on our own government. That makes the government categorically unfit to determine that firearms are a privilege. [B]We accept the additional risk that comes from this. [/B] Part of being American is accepting some measure of increased risk in return for additional freedoms. We certainly forget ourselves sometimes, but it is one of the fundamental underlying principles of who we are.[/QUOTE] the >58 people who were killed today and the thousands more who get gunned down each year probably won't agree with that bolded statement lol

[QUOTE=Killuah;52739317]Hey guy so if it only takes us what, 20 hours, to start the invitable fruitless gun discussion maybe we could take the sensible approach and talk about how to phase out the weird fetish culture that the US developed through it's history instead of flat banning. Just... you know.. an approach that would work in the real world. Where gun nuts wouldn't have to give away their beloved guns but maybe their kids are a bit different.[/QUOTE] Yeah when I go to the range me and the guys are literally jerking each other off to the thought of firearms You should see the fat fucking load I shot out to the 100 yard line when a guy started letting me tug on his """6.5 Creedmoor"""

[QUOTE=Zukriuchen;52739323]what? do job qualifications and experience suddenly cease to exist when it helps your argument?[/QUOTE] The prerequisites for being a legislature in the US is usually a minimum age and being able to lobby well enough to get the vote. Thats about it.

[QUOTE=butre;52739324]well I gotta say they haven't proven themselves to have any better ideas.[/QUOTE] Considering the current administration, I wouldn't put the blame squarely on the ones coming up with the ideas, so much as the possibility that there might be some good ones hitting brick walls. I dunno, my initial point is that it's not super helpful to consider it something that cannot be changed, deterred, or prevented. There are likely options out there, there are just any number of reasons why those options have not been accepted, heard, or put into effect. I'd much rather at least maintain some shred of hope that there is some sort of solution to this kind of thing.

[QUOTE=GunFox;52739318]This has been beaten to death. Americans keep guns as a check on our own government. That makes the government categorically unfit to determine that firearms are a privilege. [B]We accept the additional risk that comes from this. [/B] Part of being American is accepting some measure of increased risk in return for additional freedoms. We certainly forget ourselves sometimes, but it is one of the fundamental underlying principles of who we are.[/QUOTE] To be fair, and I'm not saying this to start a whole argument about what is right, but I think you need to consider the fact that some of those people might not have been okay with the freedom you're talking about. They're not "accepting the risk" so much as they are being killed as a potential side-effect of our society embracing what they view as a necessary freedom. In other words, it's potentially a price they pay for other people enforcing the second amendment in its current interpretation. That's not to say one side is right, or one side is wrong. That's not to say they're on one side or the other, either. What I am saying is that "being an American means X" is very, very incorrect, and the suggestion that these people "accepted" a risk is forcing a narrative that doesn't exist. People died. That's the story, end of story, and extrapolating based on your philosophy isn't right.

[QUOTE=Pascall;52739296]That seems like a silly statement to make. I'm sure there are proposals coming from many different avenues with different ideas from people who have experience and are much better educated on these situations than I am. Otherwise they probably shouldn't be lawmakers?[/QUOTE] Civil law in america stopped being about "the smart guys decide what's best after careful consideration and deliberation" before manifest destiny was a thing. Should you get your teaching thing going, here's a fun thing to waste your entire summer on; try getting a law changed. Any law, even a dumb one like 'any horse in city limits has to have a bridle and bit or be tied to a post'. Not repealed or removed, just changed.

[QUOTE=GunFox;52739318]This has been beaten to death. Americans keep guns as a check on our own government. That makes the government categorically unfit to determine that firearms are a privilege. [/QUOTE] Which is hilarious because that hasn't been viable for over a hundred years now. [QUOTE=GunFox;52739318][B]We accept the additional risk that comes from this. [/B][/QUOTE] I wasn't at the meeting where we all agreed to this. Just because I was born here I have to be happy with the status of American gun laws? [QUOTE=GunFox;52739318]Part of being American is accepting some measure of increased risk in return for additional freedoms. We certainly forget ourselves sometimes, but it is one of the fundamental underlying principles of who we are.[/QUOTE] Is it? If I want to be a good American I have to be happy with the status quo because 'freeedom' or something? Also who sees a mass shooting of over 50 people and have the reaction of "Well they accepted the risk" as if they were in the military or a firefighter or something. Is this nation in such a horrifyingly shitty spot that going outside means I accept the risk that I'm going to be killed?

[QUOTE=wauterboi;52739353]To be fair, and I'm not saying this to start a whole argument about what is right, but I think you need to consider the fact that some of those people might not have been okay with the freedom you're talking about. They're not "accepting the risk" so much as they are being killed as a potential side-effect of our society embracing what they view as a necessary freedom. In other words, it's potentially a price they pay for other people enforcing the second amendment in its current interpretation. That's not to say one side is right, or one side is wrong. That's not to say they're on one side or the other, either. What I am saying is that "being an American means X" is very, very incorrect, and the suggestion that these people "accepted" a risk is forcing a narrative that doesn't exist. People died. That's the story, end of story, and extrapolating based on your philosophy isn't right.[/QUOTE] if they're not ok with freedom maybe they should go somewhere like britain when they get stabbed for 20p and a pack of mayfairs they're gonna wish they had that freedom back [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Shitpost/Ban History" - Pascall))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;52739340]the >58 people who were killed today and the thousands more who get gunned down each year probably won't agree with that bolded statement lol[/QUOTE] Can you make that argument without exploiting the victims and the dead? It's really distasteful.

[QUOTE=GunFox;52739318]This has been beaten to death. Americans keep guns as a check on our own government. That makes the government categorically unfit to determine that firearms are a privilege. [B]We accept the additional risk that comes from this. [/B] Part of being American is accepting some measure of increased risk in return for additional freedoms. We certainly forget ourselves sometimes, but it is one of the fundamental underlying principles of who we are.[/QUOTE] "Yeah it's dangerous but [I]tradition[/I]™!!" I'm sorry but there may be valid arguments in favor in keeping guns, but this is not one of them.

[QUOTE=Headhumpy;52739340]the >58 people who were killed today and the thousands more who get gunned down each year probably won't agree with that bolded statement lol[/QUOTE] Can you at least wait until the dead are buried before you start dancing on their graves?

[QUOTE=Tetsmega;52739365]Can you make that argument without exploiting the victims and the dead? It's really distasteful.[/QUOTE] Okay. The massive campaign to implement stricter gun control clearly outlines the fact that many, many Americans do [I]not[/I] agree with the bolded statement. Are they somehow un-American because of that then?

[QUOTE=wauterboi;52739353]To be fair, and I'm not saying this to start a whole argument about what is right, but I think you need to consider the fact that some of those people might not have been okay with the freedom you're talking about. They're not "accepting the risk" so much as they are being killed as a potential side-effect of people embracing what they view as a necessary freedom. It's a price they pay for other people enforcing the second amendment in its current interpretation. That's not to say one side is right, or one side is wrong. That's not to say they're on one side or the other, either. What I am saying is that "being an American means X" is very, very incorrect, and you're suggesting that these people "accepted" that risk which I feel is you kind of hamfisting a narrative that doesn't exist.[/QUOTE] Attempting to sidestep from the argument by claiming that not everyone agrees isn't a particularly strong argument. Cultural norms and accepted values are obviously a thing with any nation. We have an obscene amount of firearms in circulation today and a nation founded on rebellion along with a mountain of evidence to support the US being a gun culture. A huge percentage of our design is owed to John Locke, who saw rebellion as the duty of citizens not being represented by their government. We have firearms for a pretty obvious reason.

[QUOTE=butre;52739364]if they're not ok with freedom maybe they should go somewhere like britain when they get stabbed for 20p and a pack of mayfairs they're gonna wish they had that freedom back[/QUOTE] Stabbing's don't happen in America, obviously.

[QUOTE=Tetsmega;52739365]Can you make that argument without exploiting the victims and the dead? It's really distasteful.[/QUOTE] not to mention the "lol" at the end. that's just straight fucked

[QUOTE=GunFox;52739318]This has been beaten to death. Americans keep guns as a check on our own government. That makes the government categorically unfit to determine that firearms are a privilege. [B]We accept the additional risk that comes from this. [/B] Part of being American is accepting some measure of increased risk in return for additional freedoms. We certainly forget ourselves sometimes, but it is one of the fundamental underlying principles of who we are.[/QUOTE] Guns as a check hardly keeps up with the technological advancements we have seen in recent decades. Maybe it was the case when 2nd amendment became a thing, but that's hardly the case now. It's not like most people are opting into being American either, most are born that way and simply have no choice. If hundreds of millions rose up against the government, it would topple guns or no guns. So what's the point of having the guns? How exactly is this having guns supposed to keep the government in check? In terms of keeping the government in check it only seems like it would really aid domestic terrorist groups?

[QUOTE=JeSuisIkea;52739376]Stabbing's don't happen in America, obviously.[/QUOTE] not over 20p and a pack of mayfairs they don't