Daily Stormer rejected by GoDaddy, Google and now Cloudflare. Retreats to Dark Web - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=Simplemac3;52584290]Shit lads I didn't realize we were dealing with the fucking WW2 era nazi war machine and not some pathetic white trash gangbangers this has already been gone over, european antifa are legitimately terrible about property damage among other things but the nazis still have them on violence directed at persons (which is worse, let's be honest)[/QUOTE] you're right, taking human lives and promising to continue to do so is definitley comparable to a brick through a starbucks window

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584451]I see this has turned into a partial debate about which ideology is worse? Communists vs Nazis. Yes, antifa are made up largely by those who to an extent believe in communism. In any case, both are bad so don't kid yourself. [IMG_THUMB]http://www.dailywire.com/sites/default/files/styles/article_full/public/uploads/2017/07/hammer_sickle_soviet_communist_flag.jpg?itok=G_u-yMps[/IMG_THUMB] The flag of peace, love, and tolerance apparently? I think not.[/QUOTE] Nobody here is defending communism, nobody is saying it's good. What imaginary version of FP are you reading because nobody is saying that...

[QUOTE=Uber22;52584530]Nobody here is defending communism, nobody is saying it's good. What imaginary version of FP are you reading because nobody is saying that...[/QUOTE] I don't think I did say anyone was, I only said people are debating which is worse. What?

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584451]I see this has turned into a partial debate about which ideology is worse? Communists vs Nazis. Yes, antifa are made up largely by those who to an extent believe in communism. In any case, both are bad so don't kid yourself. -ussr flag- The flag of peace, love, and tolerance apparently? I think not.[/QUOTE] one group's failings does not exonerate another group's failings

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584546]I don't think I did say anyone was, I only said people are debating which is worse. What?[/QUOTE] I would say that the ideology that wants to exterminate humans because of their arbitrary racial hierarchy is worse than the ideology that wants to establish common ownership of the means of production, yes.

[QUOTE=EXPLOOOSIONS!;52584547]one group's failings does not exonerate another group's failings[/QUOTE] I don't believe that I stated anything like that but rather that both groups should be treated as something to be gotten rid of .

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584451] Yes, antifa are made up largely by those who to an extent believe in communism.[/QUOTE] Please cite your sources

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584563]I don't believe that I stated anything like that but rather that both groups should be treated as something to be gotten rid of .[/QUOTE] i agree that extremists should be dealt with, however i disagree that antifa are in the same strain as neo-nazis. communism too is not comparable with nazism, as communism is a multi-faceted ideology that has been hi-jacked by totalitarian regimes. the ideology may be flawed, but it does not call for the extermination of lesser races which immediately puts it in "the lesser evil" category.

[QUOTE=Vodkavia;52582618]People always go "well if you ban them from x they'll just move" without realizing that the more obscure and shifty places they go the harder it is for them to casually recruit people. The internet inherently escalates the threat of extremism because of how efficient is is for transferring information and bringing people far away together. People who would have otherwise not known anything about the alt right can now just accidentally bump into it on reddit because the mods refuse to enforce the rules consistently there.[/QUOTE] There is genuine merit to chasing these fucks down enough that they have to use the dark web. I've genuinely come across results from The Daily Stillborn whilst Googling topics of controversy to actually find sources and shit to disprove Nazi/ alt-right talking points. The site was in no way a tiny blip on the Internet, it would appear in Google searches with ease. On the dark web that stops being a problem.

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584563]I don't believe that I stated anything like that but rather that both groups should be treated as something to be gotten rid of .[/QUOTE] I must have said this a half dozen times now Nazism has, at the core of its ideology, the destruction of "lesser races". Communism while co opted by violent thugs does not.

[QUOTE=Not64;52584440]This entire thread is full of dumb. Daily Stormer isn't banned from the clearnet. [B]That would be illegal[/B]. They can go to Namecheap, or Gandi, or any of the 5 million other domain registrars and setup another website. They simply chose to set up a Tor website, for whatever reason.[/QUOTE] Gonna have to run this one by me there buddy, because I'm pretty sure there's no overarching authority that can call denying Nazis a platform (or anyone a platform for that matter) on the Internet "illegal". Even if every private registrar refused to serve them, they'd still have ways to host on the surface web. It's impossible to actually stop someone from hosting stuff on the surface web, but we can sure as shit ensure they have a hard time doing so if we don't want them on [I]our[/I] platforms.

[QUOTE=TheCreeper;52584563]I don't believe that I stated anything like that but rather that both groups should be treated as something to be gotten rid of .[/QUOTE] Communism as a political ideology has as much of a right to exist as any other, the murder and enslavement of billions of people are not part of their core beliefs. Nazism on the other is a murderous hateful ideology that will kill or degrade most of the world in order to support what they to belief to be a superior race. If you're still unsure as to what a Nazi society looks like in action I'd refer you to an event in the 40s known to most as World War 2 (or WW2 for short) I eagerly await you to reply with "but Stalin tho"

[QUOTE=hexpunK;52584589]Gonna have to run this one by me there buddy, because I'm pretty sure there's no overarching authority that can call denying Nazis a platform (or anyone a platform for that matter) on the Internet "illegal". Even if every private registrar refused to serve them, they'd still have ways to host on the surface web. It's impossible to actually stop someone from hosting stuff on the surface web, but we can sure as shit ensure they have a hard time doing so if we don't want them on [I]our[/I] platforms.[/QUOTE] Uhh... what? Are you disagreeing with me? I don't understand what you're trying to say.

[QUOTE=Matthew0505;52584599][url]https://www.kommersant.ru/doc/3386016[/url] [url=https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.kommersant.ru%2Fdoc%2F3386016&edit-text=&act=url](english)[/url] Russia pulled their doman[/QUOTE] Fucking rip in piss

[QUOTE=Not64;52584607]Uhh... what? Are you disagreeing with me? I don't understand what you're trying to say.[/QUOTE] I agree that it's hard to stop them from hosting on the surface web. But you claimed it would be "illegal". So run that one by me again, because I'm p. sure it's not illegal. It'd be nigh unenforceable if it was. I know you're on a roll standing up for these poor, oppressed Nazis, but you could at least read posts y'know. It'd save me having to write this out.

[QUOTE=hexpunK;52584622]I agree that it's hard to stop them from hosting on the surface web. But you claimed it would be "illegal". So run that one by me again, because I'm p. sure it's not illegal. It'd be nigh unenforceable if it was. I know you're on a roll standing up for these poor, oppressed Nazis, but you could at least read posts y'know. It'd save me having to write this out.[/QUOTE] Oh. So you misread my post. Also, ouch. Sick burn bro.

[QUOTE=Not64;52584645]Oh. So you misread my post. Also, ouch. Sick burn bro.[/QUOTE] You claimed "banning them from the Internet" would be "illegal". I asked you to explain that. Outside of everything else in your post. Because I'm interested in how you can make that action "illegal", we already "ban" content like child porn by taking down as much of it as possible after all.

[media]https://twitter.com/torproject/status/898256109789687808[/media] :zing: [quote]We've heard that the hate-spewing website Daily Stormer has moved to a Tor onion service. We are disgusted, angered, and appalled by everything these racists stand for and do. We feel this way any time the Tor network and software are used for vile purposes. But we can't build free and open source tools that protect journalists, human rights activists, and ordinary people around the world if we also control who uses those tools. Tor is designed to defend human rights and privacy by preventing anyone from censoring things, even us. Ironically, the Tor software has been designed and written by a diverse team including people of many religions, races, gender identities, sexual orientations, and points on the (legitimate, non-Nazi) political spectrum. We are everything they claim to despise. And we work every day to defend the human rights they oppose. [/quote]

[QUOTE=RenegadeCop;52584393]We also live in a world where people are actively defending Nazis, trying to rationalize them. "They can't be that bad." Déjà vu.[/QUOTE] Is it? All I've said in this thread is that I don't think every single person subscribed to abhorrent beliefs is actively trying to be a mustache twirling villain and that I disagree with sentiment justifying hopes for violence with "they're subhuman". You will never once find me defending fascism the ideology in this thread. If someone with nazi aspirations like David Duke were elected to any position of power, fucking naturally I'd want him out ASAP. I get the sentinent that we have to be vigilant or it could happen again but I would be fucking astounded if we found ourselves in some kind of blatant german reich pastiche in the next 20 years. One big march. One death, and the entire western world right and left alike came down on these guys in a display of remarkable solidarity saying you literally have no excuse to not condemn these guys. I just don't think I'm being unreasonable for thinking "I don't think I'm contributing to the rise of neo fascism for saying it's wrong to eagerly anticipate violence so you can exact retribution" or "I think it's possible for decent people to be pressured or tricked into awful beliefs with the right manipulations or circumstances" or "you don't have to doggedly support groups with histories of reckless violence because they oppose another, worse violent group"

[QUOTE=Not64;52584607]Uhh... what? Are you disagreeing with me? I don't understand what you're trying to say.[/QUOTE] It's not illegal and your statement that it is is nothing short of wrong.

[QUOTE=Crumpet;52583603]communism doesn't intend to target any specific anyone for anything, it's the idealistic egalitarian society. like a camping trip. you can argue the intricacies of why it would or wouldn't work but it's irrelevant to this argument. nazism is based on racial hierarchy. this is the foundation of nazism. being a nazi means you believe the holocaust was justified. being a communist does not mean you think stalin's purges were justified. there is nothing intentionally or fundamentally evil about communism. they worked out shit for such fundamentally different reasons (mainly nazism is inherently terrible) that it's a non argument with no conclusion beyond 'they were both shit'. well great, but shit is far more nuanced than that. communism is also very very broad. VERY broad.[/QUOTE] Jesus fucking Christ, if you compare communism to a camping trip, I would really, really ask questions what sort of fucking camping trips you go to? The ones where everyone with glasses got genocided, everyone got worked to death, a sizable percentage tortured to death, with said camping trip ending with another camp invading because they had enough of said camp killing one in fifth of everyone of their own, and the mayhem starting to spill over towards the borders of their camping site? Communism is evil. Nazism is evil. Simple as that. The main difference between the two, is that Nazism is about killing other folks en masse, while Communism tends to end up in killing their own people in even bigger masses, be it intended or unintended.

[QUOTE=hexpunK;52584651]You claimed "banning them from the Internet" would be "illegal". I asked you to explain that. Outside of everything else in your post. Because I'm interested in how you can make that action "illegal", we already "ban" content like child porn by taking down as much of it as possible after all.[/QUOTE] Okay.... I really did not think I would have to spell this out. Ban = government ban. Because that's the only thing that would work. Illegal under the first amendment.

[QUOTE=Simplemac3;52584673]Is it? All I've said in this thread is that I don't think every single person subscribed to abhorrent beliefs is actively trying to be a mustache twirling villain and that I disagree with sentiment justifying hopes for violence with "they're subhuman". You will never once find me defending fascism the ideology in this thread. If someone with nazi aspirations like David Duke were elected to any position of power, fucking naturally I'd want him out ASAP. I get the sentinent that we have to be vigilant or it could happen again but I would be fucking astounded if we found ourselves in some kind of blatant german reich pastiche in the next 20 years. One big march. One death, and the entire western world right and left alike came down on these guys in a display of remarkable solidarity saying you literally have no excuse to not condemn these guys. I just don't think I'm being unreasonable for thinking "I don't think I'm contributing to the rise of neo fascism for saying it's wrong to eagerly anticipate violence so you can exact retribution" or "I think it's possible for decent people to be pressured or tricked into awful beliefs with the right manipulations or circumstances" or "you don't have to doggedly support groups with histories of reckless violence because they oppose another, worse violent group"[/QUOTE] David Duke is happy with how Trump is handling Charlottesville. Can you explain to me how the rest of the country could possibly be okay with it as well, when the KKK's former Grand Wizard is saying he's doing right by the white nationalists? Can we stop and think about this for a minute? I don't agree to calling them subhuman either, I'm with you on that, but you seem to think there's no chance of these people rising up. I don't. I see it as a real chance. And it's not something we should take lightly. We did 80 years ago, I truly don't believe we can afford to do that again. [editline]17th August 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Not64;52584698]Okay.... I really did not think I would have to spell this out. Ban = government ban. Because that's the only thing that would work. Illegal under the first amendment.[/QUOTE] That's not what you said so acting like everyones dumb for you needing to spell it out just reflects that you think your ideas are implicitly obvious to everyone else. They're not. Explaining things that you believe in with less vagueries is only ever a good thing. You didn't do that.

Here's my perspective on all of this - and this goes out to anyone who was shocked and appalled by my "Nazi Season" statement. I've always been one of those happy to live and let live - tolerance and striving to understand even those whose ideologies I disagree with always have been my guiding principles. There are groups I despise because their guiding ideology is diametrically opposed to mine, but I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt when they don't pose a major threat. But no matter how peace-loving a man may be, there will come enemies that cannot be reasoned with, threats to liberty and peace that cannot be appeased through words.That's just the way the world works sometimes. There are a few times when everyone must be ready to fight, as distasteful as it may be to some, to deal with dangers that threaten everything they hold dear. In the 1940s, the world saw what this ideology did when it was allowed to grow and take root, unchallenged. And if we don't learn from our history, we're doomed to repeat its mistakes. This time, we nip it in the bud. This time, we turn them away from every port, close our doors to them, turn our backs on them as human beings and as a civilization. We'll give them a chance to renounce their degeneracy if they want us to allow them back into the fold. And if they lash out in anger, we put them down. Nothing more just, nothing more righteous. We've been where they want to take us once. More than once, really, considering human history as a whole. We're not going there again.

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52584702]That's not what you said so acting like everyones dumb for you needing to spell it out just reflects that you think your ideas are implicitly obvious to everyone else. They're not. Explaining things that you believe in with less vagueries is only ever a good thing. You didn't do that.[/QUOTE] Nah. It's that everyone thinks I'm dumb, [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1571188&p=52463454&viewfull=1#post52463454]including you[/url], so you just assume everything I say is unsubstantiated bullshit and don't bother to put two and two together. Box ratings are a hell of a drug. [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Cares about ratings" - Pascall))[/highlight]

[QUOTE=archangel125;52584709]Here's my perspective on all of this - and this goes out to anyone who was shocked and appalled by my "Nazi Season" statement. I've always been one of those happy to live and let live - tolerance and striving to understand even those whose ideologies I disagree with always have been my guiding principles. There are groups I despise because their guiding ideology is diametrically opposed to mine, but I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt when they don't pose a major threat. But no matter how peace-loving a man may be, there will come enemies that cannot be reasoned with, threats to liberty and peace that cannot be appeased through words.That's just the way the world works sometimes. There are a few times when everyone must be ready to fight, as distasteful as it may be to some, to deal with dangers that threaten everything they hold dear. In the 1940s, the world saw what this ideology did when it was allowed to grow and take root, unchallenged. And if we don't learn from our history, we're doomed to repeat its mistakes. This time, we nip it in the bud. This time, we turn them away from every port, close our doors to them, turn our backs on them as human beings and as a civilization. And if they lash out in anger, we put them down. Nothing more just, nothing more righteous. We've been where they want to take us once. More than once, really, considering human history as a whole. We're not going there again.[/QUOTE] I understand where you're coming from, but you should drop the "Subhuman" shit. If you kill a nazi, you've killed a person. We shouldn't act like Nazis aren't people, they are. They might even be monstrous people, but they're human all the same. I think, the Nazis use of the term Untermensch and that whole concept is one of the most effective propaganda tools anyone's ever had. By dehumanizing them, those deaths weigh less heavily on the soldiers doing the work. We can't do that. We can't be that. We might have to fight and actually kill Nazi's in our lifetimes. But I think to those of us like you and I, we would best remember the people that died both as humans, and as nazis so we don't forget the dual lessons that are there for us all. 1) We're all humans. Even the most monstrous and devilish people are just people. There's no evil, there's no monsters under the bed. There's just people. And yes, that's scary. 2) We can only beat groups like this by being better than them, and maintaining our humanity. This doesn't mean refraining from violence, it does mean looking for other options, it does mean trying to do what we can elsewhere, but it most importantly means that if we do end up having to defend ourselves with violence, that we understand our actions killed actual human beings, terrible ones, but still. I believe that fighting with that acknowledgement is what keeps the two groups separate in the long run. [editline]17th August 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Not64;52584715]Nah. It's that everyone thinks I'm dumb, [url=https://facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=1571188&p=52463454&viewfull=1#post52463454]including you[/url], so you just assume everything I say is unsubstantiated bullshit and don't bother to put two and two together. Box ratings are a hell of a drug.[/QUOTE] The post you reference there doesn't actually show me calling you stupid. You called something fake news when it was clearly real news. what is there to say to you about that? You disagree with Trump Jr himself about the very facts of that situation, it's hard to actually talk to you if we're not sharing the same base reality because you reject whatever doesn't fit?

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52584724]The post you reference there doesn't actually show me calling you stupid.[/quote] [b]Laserbeams:[/b] Lost cause [b]You:[/b] well of course If that's not calling someone stupid then I don't know what is. Come on. Just admit it. [quote]You called something fake news when it was clearly real news. what is there to say to you about that? You disagree with Trump Jr himself about the very facts of that situation, it's hard to actually talk to you if we're not sharing the same base reality because you reject whatever doesn't fit?[/QUOTE] The "fake news" meme does not necessarily mean the news is literally fake. It was just a hype piece. The dude was saying "this is as big as watergate lol", and I was calling him out on his bullshit. And I was right. Trump is still president, after all.

[QUOTE=Not64;52584741][b]Laserbeams:[/b] Lost cause [b]You:[/b] well of course If that's not calling someone stupid then I don't know what is. Come on. Just admit it. The "fake news" meme does not necessarily mean the news is literally fake. It was just a hype piece. The dude was saying "this is as big as watergate lol", and I was calling him out on his bullshit. And I was right. Trump is still president, after all.[/QUOTE] Watergate took 2 years. That was a month ago. I think you really need to learn some historical context as to why an immediate development in a story doesn't lead to a "Later that day" outcome. [editline]17th August 2017[/editline] Also, you did literally say [QUOTE=Not64;52432178]I am done discussing semantics.[/quote] when asked for proof

[QUOTE=HumanAbyss;52584724]I understand where you're coming from, but you should drop the "Subhuman" shit. If you kill a nazi, you've killed a person. We shouldn't act like Nazis aren't people, they are. They might even be monstrous people, but they're human all the same. I think, the Nazis use of the term Untermensch and that whole concept is one of the most effective propaganda tools anyone's ever had. By dehumanizing them, those deaths weigh less heavily on the soldiers doing the work. We can't do that. We can't be that. We might have to fight and actually kill Nazi's in our lifetimes. But I think to those of us like you and I, we would best remember the people that died both as humans, and as nazis so we don't forget the dual lessons that are there for us all. 1) We're all humans. Even the most monstrous and devilish people are just people. There's no evil, there's no monsters under the bed. There's just people. And yes, that's scary. 2) We can only beat groups like this by being better than them, and maintaining our humanity. This doesn't mean refraining from violence, it does mean looking for other options, it does mean trying to do what we can elsewhere, but it most importantly means that if we do end up having to defend ourselves with violence, that we understand our actions killed actual human beings, terrible ones, but still. I believe that fighting with that acknowledgement is what keeps the two groups separate in the long run. [/QUOTE] Where you and I disagree is in the belief that being human somehow gives one's life some intrinsic value. There are certain extreme acts, in my view, through which a person's humanity is forefeit. There are also certain extreme degrees of ideological indoctrination that do the same. Past a certain point, what was once a person loses the ability to see reason and becomes like some dangerous, venomous animal, a threat to everyone else. Is it possible to come back from such brainwashing? Maybe. Some have. If they decide to harm other people, they won't get that chance. If the Nazis force us to destroy them, there's no reason to mourn them. The species is measurably better off without them.

[QUOTE=Jordax;52584692]Jesus fucking Christ, if you compare communism to a camping trip, I would really, really ask questions what sort of fucking camping trips you go to? The ones where everyone with glasses got genocided, everyone got worked to death, a sizable percentage tortured to death, with said camping trip ending with another camp invading because they had enough of said camp killing one in fifth of everyone of their own, and the mayhem starting to spill over towards the borders of their camping site? Communism is evil. Nazism is evil. Simple as that. The main difference between the two, is that Nazism is about killing other folks en masse, while Communism tends to end up in killing their own people in even bigger masses, be it intended or unintended.[/QUOTE] Christianity and Islam have lead to countless death tolls. Genocides and exterminations. Violent extremists and terrorists. I wouldn't say either of them are inherently evil though. Communism is a broken system, and is very easily exploited by the corrupt to seize power. But the ideology of Communism did not call for those purges and famines. The ideology of Nazism, however, [I]explicitly[/I] calls for the extermination of inferior races. It is [I]objectively[/I] worse than Communism. The deaths caused by Communism were due to it failing as an ideology. The deaths caused by Nazism were due to it succeeding.