[QUOTE=Mining Bill;52126192]do you think he spend a lot of time trying to fit "murder old man with pistol for no reason" into is schedule[/QUOTE]
he made the old man say his ex partners name, he spelt out his reasons in his video.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52126321]he made the old man say his ex partners name, he spelt out his reasons in his video.[/QUOTE]
and do those sound like the actions of a sane man to you?
Imagine being the guy at the payment window and suddenly seeing him roll up.
I swear, I'd shit a brick.
Police must be pissed, damn McDonalds is going to get the credit
[QUOTE=Aathma;52126058]Question, why do we assume evil is the result of mental instability? Is evil inherently insane, or are we afraid of the idea of sane people not being inherently good?[/QUOTE]
Is this going to turn into some kind of those completely worthless semantic-based middle school level philosophy things where we question whats truly ~evil~ and ~insane~
[QUOTE=TheTalon;52128703]Police must be pissed, damn McDonalds is going to get the credit[/QUOTE]
I think the employees at the McDonalds deserves some credit. It took balls to stall a dude that they knew had a gun and pretty much nothing to lose.
[QUOTE=J!NX;52128712]Is this going to turn into some kind of those completely worthless semantic-based middle school level philosophy things where we question whats truly ~evil~ and ~insane~[/QUOTE]
Honestly, he has a bit of a point.
I'm more inclined to think that he acted purely out of emotional impulse, then later attempted to justify the act by making it seem he was crazy/that he snapped.
Of course, I'm not going to say with 100% certainty that mental issues didn't play a part, I'm not qualified to make that assumption. I just think it's likely that other factors could have been involved, especially given that we (as far as I'm currently aware) know little about him and his past other than what he divulged in his Facebook streams.
[QUOTE=Sir Whoopsalot;52128689]Imagine being the guy at the payment window and suddenly seeing him roll up.
I swear, I'd shit a brick.[/QUOTE]
I don't know the official term for it but I have trouble telling the difference in peoples faces so I'd probably be pretty fine and even ask him how his days going.
I'm not very good for situations like that :(
[QUOTE=Sift;52129133]I don't know the official term for it but I have trouble telling the difference in peoples faces so I'd probably be pretty fine and even ask him how his days going.
I'm not very good for situations like that :([/QUOTE]
I'm mostly the opposite. I can remember faces a lot better than I remember names.
So I'd probably be standing there thinking "Weird, could've sworn I've seen him before... The hell is his name... Sam? Samson? Stewart?"
[QUOTE=Marbalo;52128792]It isn't worthless, it's an increasingly important question because it deals with the core principles of psychology, and, yes, philosophy. It also helps us understand, by promoting a discussion, that not everyone who commits murder is inherently mentally ill. A person may commit murder in absolute lucidity, and justify it to himself adequately before and after the act is committed.
The concept of mentally sane individuals committing murder is very concerning, and deserves to be discussed and studied. It's not worthless, nor is it related in anyway to semantics, because it deals in fundamental ideas, not definitions.[/QUOTE]
I think any actual psychologist will tell you that yes, sane people can commit horrible acts of crime
it's not really something that is out of the question. Every murderer in existence has their own motivations, except for ones who don't know any better.
This isn't some unknown phenomenon that just never happens.
In fact, tens of thousands of completely aware people are conditioned to commit murder in the name of some bullshit ideology.
[QUOTE=Zero-Point;52129142]I'm mostly the opposite. I can remember faces a lot better than I remember names.
So I'd probably be standing there thinking "Weird, could've sworn I've seen him before... The hell is his name... Sam? Samson? Stewart?"[/QUOTE]
Yeah my life is a complete nightmare. I have people come up to me time to time going "Eyy dude it's been awhile how ya been?" and I just have to awkwardly laugh it off because "who is this person what do they want from me?"
I literally have to remember people by the types of clothes they wear and the hairstyles they normally have and even then it's a crapshoot. It sucks
[QUOTE=Mining Bill;52126473]and do those sound like the actions of a sane man to you?[/QUOTE]
i'm not qualified to make that judgement. he comes across to me as bitter and twisted.
[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52126109]are we going to see this argument every time someone goes on a killing spree or commits a murder?
"Oh have some empathy, you don't know what it's like, have you any idea what mental illness is."
there isn't one single thread of evidence to prove this cowardly murderer was mentally ill.[/QUOTE]
What he did and his thought process for doing so inherently makes him mentally ill.
People are not just evil. People don't just arbitrarily do bad things because they're "bad" people.
There is [i]always[/i] a reason behind everything that happens. It's not always a reason you understand, sometimes not a reason you [i]can[/i] understand, but it's [i]always there[/i], and with something as extreme as this it was probably a very, very long string of things that would lead to him snapping like this. And he most certainly did snap at some point along the way.
I think you might have the wrong idea about what a mental illness actually is. We use terms like "Autism" and "Scizophrenia" or whatever else you can think of to define mental illnesses, But it's important to remember that these are just labels for a specific kind of aberration in a person's brain that usually causes symptoms that roughly fall into a certain category.
It's not a hard or physical definition in the same way that say, Iron being a kind of Atom is. It's a loose category of similar and very significant defects in an extremely complicated organ that we still don't truly understand. And what's important to note is, just about everyone is mentally ill. Everyone.
It's just minor things usually, not on the same scale as being obsessive compulsive or what have you, but just about everyone develops some small mental issues over time, especially if they're subjected to stress or trauma.
The fact that this guy snapped like this [i]inherently[/i] means he was mentally ill.
Biologically we have a whole set of safeguards that stop us from doing this kind of thing, even killing other people in self defense is mentally and emotionally difficult for a so called "normal" person. This is a big part of why so many soldiers get so fucked up after wars, along with the immense and constant danger to their own lives.
But some defect in this person's brain not only overwrote those instincts, but his thought process had been so warped over the years that he somehow thought this was the best possible way to get what he wanted. This is a person who is very, very damaged.
[QUOTE=Sift;52129247]Yeah my life is a complete nightmare. I have people come up to me time to time going "Eyy dude it's been awhile how ya been?" and I just have to awkwardly laugh it off because "who is this person what do they want from me?"
I literally have to remember people by the types of clothes they wear and the hairstyles they normally have and even then it's a crapshoot. It sucks[/QUOTE]
Sounds like prosopagnosia.
[QUOTE=helpiminabox;52130307]Sounds like prosopagnosia.[/QUOTE]
Sounds familiar and probably the case.
Ah well I guess.
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;52125506]i think it is pretty damaging and stigmatizing to people with mental health issues to imply that everyone with them has a chance of breaking and murdering people.
[editline]19th April 2017[/editline]
like jesus dude the vast majority of people struggling with mental health will never come close to considering murdering people at random. that is the minority of cases[/QUOTE]
Your point? It's a minority of cases, but these cases [I]because of our disregard for it.[/I]
Like, the general and immediate reaction to this is:
[QUOTE=LtKyle2;52125393]He takes someones else life and is such a bitch he doesn't want to face the consequences. All because of some "Joy Lane".
Good riddance, at least. The world is better off now.[/QUOTE]
Which [I]completely ignores[/I] any other factor. People call him a "coward" for killing himself, thinking him to be a rational yet evil man. He wasn't. He was sick, to the extreme, and American culture has such an intense disregard that [I]it happens.[/I] Yes, I know that the majority of mentally ill people just suffer quietly and struggle for themselves, but that doesn't take away that these murders still happen like this.
It's like having an untied shoe lace, and occasionally stepping on it. A mild inconvenience, a struggle, but you can live. Eventually you trip, fall, and fracture something. Someone tells you "you [I]really[/I] should have paid attention and taken care of that shoe lace," and your response is "my fracture is only a minority of cases."
And before you say I'm equating a shoe lace with mental health, it's an "analogy" or "metaphor."
[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;52125569]i've been seeing this a lot recently, people saying "we need to end the stigma on mental illness in this country" and "everyone who is mentally ill has a chance of snapping and murdering". that is actively promoting the stigmas you want to get rid of.[/QUOTE]
If you're putting it in quotes I'm sure you'll be able to point to where he said "everyone who is mentally ill has a chance of snapping and murdering".
Perhaps you're extracting something that was never said from what he did say, which was simply that we [i]do not[/i] have a society that encourages taking care of your mental health and that [i]absolutely[/i] means that cases like this become more extreme over time.
To put it simply: no, he at no point attempted to say that everyone with mental illness has a chance of "snapping and murdering". However, [i]those who do snap and murder people[/i] are mentally ill and [i]providing the necessary help and encouragement to all people suffering from mental illness[/i] will inherently help the extreme cases.
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