Shooting at Florida School, Shooter IS in custody. - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=Panthereye;53131960]The fact that these events happened today doesn't dismiss anyone's arguments. [b]This shit happens all the time, that's the problem.[/b] People are going to keep dying unless something is done about it.[/QUOTE] And I agree, we absolutely should talk about it and there needs to be serious discussion about the problem with guns, but not by using people currently in danger of being killed.

[QUOTE=joshuadim;53131958]Is there official confirmation/source for this?[/QUOTE] Just listening to the livestream, and that's what the news reporter was saying.

They just replayed the video from before and I got a screenshot [img]https://i.imgur.com/AzeSfuw.jpg[/img]

[QUOTE=joshuadim;53131953]So you want to bring up politics right now, and by extension use the people currently in danger in an active shooting situation as a means to prop up your argument. Can you at least have the decency to make sure the situation has ended and they aren't in danger anymore before using them in your gun debate?[/QUOTE] In one ear out the other with people like you, jesus christ. Here's the cycle, as you perpetuate it. 1. Shooting occurs. People want to talk. You say it's too early, wait for it to be over. 2. Days go by, victims recover. People want to talk. You say it's too early, let people mourn. 3. Go back to step 1. This happens every fucking time. It's always "too early". It's never a "good time to talk".

[QUOTE=Coyoteze;53131970]In one ear out the other with people like you, jesus christ. Here's the cycle, as you perpetuate it. 1. Shooting occurs. People want to talk. You say it's too early, wait for it to be over. 2. Days go by, victims recover. People want to talk. You say it's too early, let people mourn. 3. Go back to step 1. This happens every fucking time. It's always "too early". It's never a "good time to talk".[/QUOTE] Thanks for the insult, appreciate it. Like I said, the time to talk is AFTER the situation has been diffused and the shooter has been apprehended (which it seems he has been).

[QUOTE=Coyoteze;53131938]... both of those are murder, and with the same prerequisite. Gun in school, fired with intent to kill or main. It doesn't matter if it was ideologically caused, or by happenstance of someone snapping. It's a school shooting. Firearm discharged in a school district for purpose of injury and death. That's a school shooting. School. Shooting. How is this so hard to understand?[/QUOTE] if "school shooting" wasn't such an emotionally charged arrangement of words I might agree with you but there's a massive difference between a plain old murder and gunning down 50 people who are unconnected in every way other than being the same area.

[QUOTE=Kiwi;53131973][url]https://www.abc15.com/news/national/shooting-reported-at-high-school-in-florida[/url] I don't know why you're so oblivious to not reading the thread and doing a quick google that the shooter IS IN CUSTODY[/QUOTE] Yeah I just checked it now, he's in custody. And as I said before, NOW should be the time for discourse and talks since the situation has been diffused and he's in custody. I want to know what the shooter's motives were and I hope the police can get something out of him.

[QUOTE=Alxnotorious;53131965]A good first place to start with gun control would be to create the environment where gun control is possible. Because Republican politicians classically have the backing of the NRA, the only option from a local, state, and federal level is to elect a more strongly Democratic political base that is willing to pass laws on gun control. Admittedly, it will take something like a generation for effective gun control to undergo revision and take good affect, but this starts at a governmental stage first.[/QUOTE] the million dollar question tho is how you break the nra's and the gun manufacturer's and fox news's backs for any meaningful improvements, first we gotta change the culture around guns and start mutating the popular interpretation of the second amendment to something more reasonable, because without popular support (see prohibition) any legislation will simply be ignored. this would be extremely difficult because of the gop fear machine and the inertia of decades of millions of conservatives with a very, very liberal idea of what the 2nd amendment means. you're talking a multiple-generation effort. then we gotta actually remove them from circulation because since the country is saturated with firearms it's impossible to stop people from getting them illegally, and that would also take generations for buybacks or restrictions on the manufacturers or whatever else to take effect -- during which time the gop, both the party of bribery AND wedded to the gunmaker lobby, would be gleefully eviscerating any legislation harming poor remington's profits -- unless you want to try for a quick reduction, which would have every ammon bundy and every wannabe tim mcveigh screaming revolution. i really can't see much improving, not with the way the government constantly switches teams and with the level of propaganda the gop machine is unashamed of putting out

[QUOTE=joshuadim;53131976]Thanks for the insult, appreciate it. Like I said, the time to talk is AFTER the situation has been diffused and the shooter has been apprehended (which it seems he has been).[/QUOTE] Cool, can we talk about the political issues that arise from school shootings now without you shooting down people's arguments for being "too soon"?

[URL="https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2011/10/why-more-americans-suffer-from-mental-disorders-than-anyone-else/246035/"]america is the most mentally ill country in the world[/URL], and i think that lack of free access to mental health professionals is only part of the issue. there's something about living in this country that causes mental health decline, and shootings are a symptom of that.

[QUOTE=TraderRager;53131961]Okay, I'm imagining. I propose a bill where the nation offers a mass buyback all firearms semi-automatic firearms and institutes more thorough background checks and stronger punishments for those who allow firearms to end up in the possession of unlicensed users. It also closes the Gun Show loophole. Use of any firearm capable of semi-automatic fire (including pistols) requires a different license then more traditional hunting weapons (Bolt, Lever, Pump, and Break-action type firearms). Continued ownership of the before mentioned semi-automatic firearms is a felony, but you have 12 months from when the legislation is passed to sell them or get the new license.[/QUOTE] there is no gun show loophole. I don't know what jackass started that rumor but you fill out the same form and receive the same background check as if you went to a gun store.

I thought Poldicks was created so people would stop shitting up the thread with constant replies about who's right and wrong.

I'm in agreement that the discussion should start after the situation is over. Which it seems to be. People who need to mourn will mourn but the rest of the country has a responsibly to figure stuff out. Society as a whole shouldn't grind to a stop everytime a bakers dozen people get killed by a madman. We gotta figure it out. We gotta start filling in the cracks through which mass killers fall through.

[QUOTE=Panthereye;53131946]Why is mental health not taken more seriously by school and government officials? [/QUOTE] Just to tackle this one in particular, it goes back to the Reagan era. The Republicans have shat on mental health care in the United States by cutting funding to institutions, causing many to close down and the few that remained in operation had to turn away patients because they cannot afford to handle any more. Privately owned institutions are expensive and chances are, many of those people who need care cannot afford it so they deteriorate over time. EDIT: Let's face it, gun control and fixing mental health is very much against the Conservative Platform

Shooter suspect taken in a stretcher.

[QUOTE=joshuadim;53131978]Yeah I just checked it now, he's in custody. And as I said before, NOW should be the time for discourse and talks since the situation has been diffused and he's in custody. I want to know what the shooter's motives were and I hope the police can get something out of him.[/QUOTE] Do you not feel totally embarrassed typing this out? Like, 5 minutes ago it was too soon, but [I]now[/I] we have your permission to discuss gun control?

:snip: Merge was cut off

[QUOTE=butre;53131990]there is no gun show loophole. I don't know what jackass started that rumor but you fill out the same form and receive the same background check as if you went to a gun store.[/QUOTE] No? In AZ you can go to a gun show and buy a gun without any licensing or paperwork assuming it's a private seller.

[QUOTE=JoeSkylynx;53131910]Also, wait till after the shooting too debate politics. It's distasteful as hell too start debating politics when the shooting is still active.[/QUOTE] Fortunately, like many in this thread, I'm not personally affected in any way by this shooting. It's so fucking tiring at this point to simply express condolences, which at this point are essentially implied. I feel for everyone involved, and I want something actually done, and I'm going to call for it. We get our news in an instant now. Is it distasteful to call for action so quickly? Maybe it is. But it's much more effective to point to the shit that's happening [i]right fucking now[/i] and say that this, right here and right now, is happening [i]way too much[/i]. This shit has to stop. You know what else is distasteful? Mass shootings.

[media]https://twitter.com/TheCaptainAidan/status/963887047722389505[/media]

[QUOTE=srobins;53132000]Do you not feel totally embarrassed typing this out? Like, 5 minutes ago it was too soon, but [I]now[/I] we have your permission to discuss gun control?[/QUOTE] I just didn't feel comfortable bringing up and discussing politics when people's lives were in danger of being taken from them. I guess I'll just never understand that because it feels wrong to me. If someone could explain to me in PMs I would greatly appreciate it, I'll stop posting in the thread now because it seems all I'm doing is not helping.

I think the most fucked up part of all of this is if you google the story, how many online news organizations are clammering for clicks and views from people curious about the story so they make sensational headline to attract viewer ship. Aka doing the completely opposite of what they should be doing which is let local news cover the story instead of blowing it up. The whole system makes me sick to my stomach.

[QUOTE=Ninja Gnome;53131989][URL="https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2011/10/why-more-americans-suffer-from-mental-disorders-than-anyone-else/246035/"]america is the most mentally ill country in the world[/URL], and i think that lack of free access to mental health professionals is only part of the issue. there's something about living in this country that causes mental health decline, and shootings are a symptom of that.[/QUOTE] R: "This isn't about gun control, it's a about mental health!" D: "Okay, I agree mental health is a problem. Maybe we should put more money into it and reestablish our countries shattered mental health system so people in need can get help." R: "..." D: *Proposes legislation to help with Mental Health Care* R: "Damn socialist with your free health care, we need to spend that money on the military! What do you want to spend money on crazy people for anyways?"

[QUOTE=srobins;53132006]No? In AZ you can go to a gun show and buy a gun without any licensing or paperwork assuming it's a private seller.[/QUOTE] very few private citizens do gun shows, the ones who do usually aren't selling, or at least aren't selling guns.

[QUOTE=joshuadim;53131966]but not by using people currently in danger of being killed.[/QUOTE] what the hell does this even mean

In this current state is more about mental health than anything. I can't speak for gun controll, but this kind of people will get their weapons regardless legally or not, so i wonder if it will decline in anything.

[QUOTE=Llamalord;53132016]I think the most fucked up part of all of this is if you google the story, how many online news organizations are clammering for clicks and views from people curious about the story so they make sensational headline to attract viewer ship. Aka doing the completely opposite of what they should be doing which is let local news cover the story instead of blowing it up. The whole system makes me sick to my stomach.[/QUOTE] Society is the problem.

Looks like a fucking police convention in front of the school. Easily 100 police cars. I really hope reforms with guns really does come, I just don't know how; with how guns were engrained into American culture

[QUOTE=Luni;53131982]the million dollar question tho is how you break the nra's and the gun manufacturer's and fox news's backs to achieve any meaningful change we gotta change the culture around guns and neutralize the gop fear machine and get the majority of americans onto a more rational interpretation of the 2nd amendment, and simultaneously we gotta start removing guns from circulation cus the country is saturated and it's impossible to stop people from getting their hands on them, and all that shit could easily take 20 or 30 years (meanwhile, every 8 years the government switches teams and dismantles everything that happened in the previous 8 years) i really can't see any sustained effort lasting very long, not with the government switching back and forth every two terms and with the level of propaganda the gop machine is unashamed of putting out[/QUOTE] The country is seeing the next generation of politicians enter the stage now. The next two to four upcoming election years will set the stage. Luckily, it appears the backlash from the 2016 election is encouraging more liberal young adults to run for office. If the domino effect can continue past 2018, there is a good chance of some actual change, but voters must be driven to vote. The best solution to our problems now is future-proofing the political landscape. I'm not saying the Democrats will be the end-all, but it's a good start, especially considering where we are now.

[QUOTE=butre;53131990]there is no gun show loophole. I don't know what jackass started that rumor but you fill out the same form and receive the same background check as if you went to a gun store.[/QUOTE] In all but 19 states you can sell a firearm without a background check or waiting period, but FLL licensed gun stores require these things. Some gun show booths might comply with FLL, but many of them do not at all and can legally sell firearms without even seeing an ID.