American Man Gives Nazi Salute in Germany, Gets Punched in the Face - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=Oblivion Knight;52569947]Man, I'd love to see some of those communist posters who "came out of the woodwork"! Go ahead and show me, please![/QUOTE] Here's a few. More in the Charlottesville thread. Also, communist apologists are just as bad as actual communists, just like nazi apologists are as bad as nazis. [QUOTE=d00msdaydan;52568590]Communists don't want to exterminate me and everybody like me for the crime of being born[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=gk99;52568660]Uh, why would they? Communism doesn't involve racism as a core value. "I wonder if people here would feel the same about someone punching a capitalist in the face."[/QUOTE] [QUOTE=eirexe;52568564]They are not comparable, there are non-violent communists, there are no non-violent nazis, communists don't have racism and hatred at the core of their ideology.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=GrizzlyBear;52569949]If someone calling you out on something pushes you to an ideology which promotes the extermination of minorities, then you have some serious issues.[/QUOTE] And how are we then supposed to solve that? Give them access to mental health or simply punch them until they yield? Because dialogue aint happening. I also see it as unlikely that most of the extremists want to actually exterminate ethnic groups.

[QUOTE=Laserbeams;52569956]Here's a few. More in the Charlottesville thread. Also, communist apologists are just as bad as actual communists, just like nazi apologists are as bad as nazis.[/QUOTE] Does pointing out a false equivalence make me an apologist now or do you genuinely believe communist ideology is rooted in violent ethnic cleansing to maintain the purity of the white race?

[QUOTE=GrizzlyBear;52569949]If someone calling you out on something pushes you to an ideology which promotes the extermination of minorities, then you have some serious issues.[/QUOTE] People tend to entrench themselves further when an idea is challenged in a bad way. In the case of nazis etc... it tends to be "See, they're proving us right!". The Derek Black example I used in the other thread is an example of this, when everyone at his college first found out about his stances he was socially ostracized, which led him further down that path. It didn't make him rethink his views, to him it said "wow everything we've been saying is right!". He doubled down and started organizing a conference on how to "combat the liberals". Change only happened in that case once people started treating Derek like a human being, and after a while he gave up his neo-nazi views.

[QUOTE=d00msdaydan;52569967]Does pointing out a false equivalence make me an apologist now or do you genuinely believe communist ideology is rooted in violent ethnic cleansing to maintain the purity of the white race?[/QUOTE] Why not? Communists have committed genocide before

[QUOTE=d00msdaydan;52569967]Does pointing out a false equivalence make me an apologist now or do you genuinely believe communist ideology is rooted in violent ethnic cleansing to maintain the purity of the white race?[/QUOTE] Laserbeams is Ukrainian. Communism left his country and many around it in a very ugly state. [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor]He knows a thing or two about its ugly side.[/url] No, genocide isn't an intrinsic part of communism, but there haven't been any communist states without violent oppression and overall evilness that I can think of. People who espouse support for communist states are no better than people who get misty-eyed over the good old days of Germany ca. 1938. It's pretty ignorant for you, as an American, to sit there and try to justify communism to a victim of the evil communist hellbeast that was the USSR.

[QUOTE=Zillamaster55;52568542]I wonder if people here would feel the same about someone punching a communist in the face. It's a legitimate question.[/QUOTE] if they're being a belligerent asshole

[QUOTE=Laserbeams;52569956]Here's a few. More in the Charlottesville thread. Also, communist apologists are just as bad as actual communists, just like nazi apologists are as bad as nazis.[/QUOTE] I don't want to push this thread off topic to the merits of communism but what they said in their posts isn't expressly wrong. As much evil has been committed in the name of communism, nothing about the core, structural idea relies on racial or ethnic superiority. And again would like to point out that they were replying to someone making a strawman out of support for communism on FP , not coming out of nowhere to speak to the virtues of communism, like you claimed. [QUOTE=Laserbeams;52568928]Maybe the fact that the communists always come out of the woodwork when that happens and say "see how much better we are" has something to do with it[/QUOTE] [editline]13th August 2017[/editline] "I bet you wouldn't say that if it was a Communist that got punched :smug:" "No because here are the differences between Communists and Nazis" "Wow these goddamn Communists appearing out of nowhere talking about how much better they are then Nazis"

[QUOTE=Grenadiac;52569984]Laserbeams is Ukrainian. Communism left his country and many around it in a very ugly state. [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor]He knows a thing or two about its ugly side.[/url] No, genocide isn't an intrinsic part of communism, but there haven't been any communist states without violent oppression and overall evilness that I can think of. People who espouse support for communist states are no better than people who get misty-eyed over the good old days of Germany ca. 1938. It's pretty ignorant for you, as an American, to sit there and try to justify communism to a victim of the evil communist hellbeast that was the USSR.[/QUOTE] I certainly don't think of myself as a victim of the USSR, but it's true that ignorant sheltered westerners advocating communism infuriate me to no end.

[QUOTE=Grenadiac;52569984]It's pretty ignorant for you, as an American, to sit there and try to justify communism to a victim of the evil communist hellbeast that was the USSR.[/QUOTE] He's justifying communism? I thought he was only saying that communists don't believe in ethnic cleansing and the Aryan race. Am I wrong, did he say that and I missed it?

[QUOTE=Grenadiac;52569984] It's pretty ignorant for you, as an American, to sit there and try to justify communism to a victim of the evil communist hellbeast that was the USSR.[/QUOTE] He's not justifying communism he is saying it's not the same as Nazism.

I could say that Scientologists generally don't follow Hitler. Doesn't mean I'm justifying Scientology.

[QUOTE=Raidyr;52570001]I don't want to push this thread off topic to the merits of communism but what they said in their posts isn't expressly wrong. As much evil has been committed in the name of communism, nothing about the core, structural idea relies on racial or ethnic superiority. And again would like to point out that they were replying to someone making a strawman out of support for communism on FP , not coming out of nowhere to speak to the virtues of communism, like you claimed. [/QUOTE] Instead of racial and ethnic superiority the communists have class warfare. It's just as bad as racism, and just about as many people were killed in the name of class warfare and seizing the means of production. And there are people on Facepunch who unironically support it.

[QUOTE=Laserbeams;52569975]Why not? Communists have committed genocide before[/QUOTE] Except it was mostly because of Authoritarian rulers that caused that

[QUOTE=Laserbeams;52570028]Instead of racial and ethnic superiority the communists have class warfare. It's just as bad as racism, and just about as many people were killed in the name of class warfare and seizing the means of production.[/QUOTE] Just because the end results are similar doesn't mean that both blocs are similar. Genocide has been waged by imperialists, communists, fascists, socialists, and by mercantile capitalists. If you are going to strawman like Zillamaster did and imply that the same people who support punching Nazis would become hypocrites by not supporting punching communists you are going to get people make arguments for why the comparison really isn't that valid. It's just another "I bet you guys wouldn't care if it was [x] instead of [y]", only even more absurd than usual because FP is [I]overwhelmingly [/I]anti-Communist. [QUOTE=Laserbeams;52570028]And there are people on Facepunch who unironically support it.[/QUOTE] We have like two people who support communism and I don't think either of them support man-made famine or genocide.

Like i said in the other thread. This shouldn't be related to the fucking left-right political spectrum The fucking fact is that we have a group of people who believe in genocide and the slaughtering of anyone thats different than them. Communist, Socialist, Capitalist, Democrat, Republican, Democratic Socialist, Libertarian, whoever the fuck you are. Nazism is god awful, and there is no other fucking political spectrum that is on par with its complete lack and disregard for humanity and empathy.

[QUOTE=The golden;52568738]Facepunch has quite the base of Nazi sympathizers. It's rather unfortunate.[/QUOTE] How deluded do you have to be to think that people that are against violence in general are fucking nazi sympathizers. Like do some of you realize how utterly deluded and extremist you've become?

[QUOTE=Raidyr;52570016]He's not justifying communism he is saying it's not the same as Nazism.[/QUOTE] Communism isn't the same as Nazism but it's equally deplorable. Replying to the question "should commies also get decked if it's cool to deck Nazis" with "communists didn't commit genocide" is an ignorant and apologist mindset, because a) they did and b) no such thing as "clean" communism has ever been practiced on a state level. [QUOTE=Uber22;52570031]Except it was mostly because of Authoritarian rulers that caused that[/QUOTE] Communism as an ideology lends itself to corruption and abuse. Even if the idea is innocent and utopian, it can't realistically be practiced without turning into something terrible. It's a fantasy. Subscribing to it is at best naive and at worst incredibly sinister.

[QUOTE=Laserbeams;52570028]Instead of racial and ethnic superiority the communists have class warfare. It's just as bad as racism, and just about as many people were killed in the name of class warfare and seizing the means of production. And there are people on Facepunch who unironically support it.[/QUOTE] Why are you defending Nazism? Surely, if pointing out that the problems with communism are a different discussion from the problems with Nazism and white supremacy is defending communism, you doing the opposite is the same as defending Nazis. This is the same exact line of reasoning that you're taking so you should have no issues with this. So, why are you defending the Nazis so much? [editline]13th August 2017[/editline] I mean, we're in threads discussing the zeitgeist of Nazi terrorism especially in the wake of the events of the last day or so, and you're here going "But what about communists?" Surely, you're defending Nazism...

[QUOTE=Thlis;52570041]How deluded do you have to be to think that people that are against violence in general are fucking nazi sympathizers. Like do some of you realize how utterly deluded and extremist you've become?[/QUOTE] How did you get that out of what he typed? Can you guys just reply to the posts people make instead of just making shit up.

[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;52570046]Why are you defending Nazism? Surely, if pointing out that the problems with communism are a different discussion from the problems with Nazism and white supremacy is defending communism, you doing the opposite is the same as defending Nazis. This is the same exact line of reasoning that you're taking so you should have no issues with this. So, why are you defending the Nazis so much? [editline]13th August 2017[/editline] I mean, we're in threads discussing the zeitgeist of Nazi terrorism especially in the wake of the events of the last day or so, and you're here going "But what about communists?" Surely, you're defending Nazism...[/QUOTE] Its like seriously, we fucking get it, Communism fucking sucks, but that doesn't fucking deny the fact that Nazism is goddamn awful.

[QUOTE=Raidyr;52570054]How did you get that out of what he typed? Can you guys just reply to the posts people make instead of just making shit up.[/QUOTE] Rich considering how the people calling others Nazi sympathizers are the ones making things up. Last thread was so fucked up that people thought they had to preface "I'm not a Nazi apologist" before saying "murder is bad"

[QUOTE=Uber22;52570055]Its like seriously, we fucking get it, Communism fucking sucks, but that doesn't fucking deny the fact that Nazism is goddamn awful.[/QUOTE] I don't think anyone arguing along this line is doing it to defend or deflect from Nazism. The point should be that neither extreme is good and you shouldn't cheer on communists just because they're going after Nazis. Communists seem much less sinister at face value, but they're just as bad.

[QUOTE=Grenadiac;52570042]Communism isn't the same as Nazism but it's equally deplorable. Replying to the question "should commies also get decked if it's cool to deck Nazis" with "communists didn't commit genocide" is an ignorant and apologist mindset, because a) they did and b) no such thing as "clean" communism has ever been practiced on a state level. [/QUOTE] Did you actually read the replies to that post? No one outright said that communists don't commit genocide.

[QUOTE=Raidyr;52570059]Did you actually read the replies to that post? No one outright said that communists don't commit genocide.[/QUOTE] You're right, he set stupid and specific goalposts, so I'll respond to the original sentiment. Have communists embarked on a campaign of ethnic cleansing to protect the purity of the white race? No, they haven't. Does that fact alone make them better than Nazis? No, it doesn't. Communism deserves no defense and should be handled with the same gloves as Nazism.

[QUOTE=Thlis;52570056]Rich considering how the people calling others Nazi sympathizers are the ones making things up. [/QUOTE] This only works if you assume The golden thinks people who preach non-violence are Nazi sympathizers, which nothing in her post belied. She just said that there are Nazi sympathizers on FP. Your imagination is building the rest.

[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;52570046]Why are you defending Nazism? Surely, if pointing out that the problems with communism are a different discussion from the problems with Nazism and white supremacy is defending communism, you doing the opposite is the same as defending Nazis. This is the same exact line of reasoning that you're taking so you should have no issues with this. So, why are you defending the Nazis so much? [editline]13th August 2017[/editline] I mean, we're in threads discussing the zeitgeist of Nazi terrorism especially in the wake of the events of the last day or so, and you're here going "But what about communists?" Surely, you're defending Nazism...[/QUOTE] Except that's not what I'm doing at all? Nice try at a sick burn, though

[QUOTE=Thlis;52570056] Last thread was so fucked up that people thought they had to preface "I'm not a Nazi apologist" before saying "murder is bad"[/QUOTE] It was one person and this was his post [QUOTE=Cyke Lon bee;52564924]I guess I'm a nazi apologist because I'm not comfortable with people calling for the extermination of a group of people. Wohkay I give up here[/QUOTE] To which someone retorts [QUOTE=UnidentifiedFlyingTard;52564931]Exterminating a harmful ideology ≠ exterminating people.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Laserbeams;52570069]Except that's not what I'm doing at all? Nice try at a sick burn, though[/QUOTE] Are you implying that putting words in other people's mouths is somehow intellectually dishonest? Am I being dishonest for extrapolating a faulty agenda from your posts?

[QUOTE=SGTNAPALM;52570079]Are you implying that putting words in other people's mouths is somehow intellectually dishonest?[/QUOTE] Explain the purpose of arguing that the specific reason communists committed genocide makes them less bad than Nazis within the context of this discussion if not to defend communism. If d00msdaydan's intent was not to defend communism, it should be easy for someone to step forward and explain why communists are undeserving of being punched if Nazis deserve to be punched.