[UK] Explosion at Manchester Arena -- 22 dead + 50 Injured - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=hexpunK;52266762]p. fucking big difference between an air raid that you'll hopefully see coming from miles away because planes can't exactly conceal themselves, and a statistically unlikely event like a terrorist attack.[/QUOTE] Going to a big event, ie the exact type of place they'd target, is a good way to raise that statistical likelyhood. You can't blame people for being cautious and being cautious isn't "letting the terrorists win". The terrorists don't give a shit about whether you go to a football game or not, they want to terrorise people into giving in to their demands and accepting their terms, which in ISIS' case is the global acceptance of their brand of islam and to attempt to put off the west from intervening with their attempt to dominate the middle east. I mean it's totally backfired since all they've done is make the west intervene more resulting in massive territory losses, but that is their aim.

[QUOTE=kevinspacey;52266671]This is the equivalent of you telling people they should jump off the back of their boats in waters where a great white was seen hunting 30 minutes earlier because "Acktully... statistically speaking..."[/QUOTE] I would do it to look at the shark...

Hi all I browse this forum a lot but I do not post much, I just wanted to say that I actually live about 20/25min away from the Arena and I heard the explosion when I was out with my dog at around 10:30 PM last night. My dog actually stopped first and I looked around wondering what it was, I live next a motorway so it isn't rare to hear someones exhaust pop or a tyre go but it felt much further away. I didn't think much of it until I got back to the house and by chance clicked a news site to see reports of an explosion, my heart kind of sank when people were saying things like it was a balloon or a speaker going because I knew there was no way I would hear that from where I live. I have been to the arena but it was many years ago, back when it was still called the M.E.N (Manchester Evening News) arena. I always thought it would be Old Trafford or the Ethiad (City's stadium) but generally security there is much, much tighter than at the MEN/Manchester Arena. I went out today to a busy shopping precinct in Denton, Manchester and there was still a lot of people there. I don't think people were put off going anywhere or doing anything, but it did feel pretty sombre to walk the dog tonight and see so many TV's in peoples houses on news channels. I still remember hearing that explosion and how quiet it was after, I don't think I will ever forget that. Just thought I'd post since I actually live in this city, thanks for all the well wishes.

[QUOTE=kevinspacey;52266671]its great to see people who live in countries that have has close to 0 terror attacks and who dont leave their houses for the majority of their lives roll off hackneyed lines about terrorists winning give me a fucking break. This is the equivalent of you telling people they should jump off the back of their boats in waters where a great white was seen hunting 30 minutes earlier because "Acktully... statistically speaking..."[/QUOTE] If that great white was somehow between you and ordinary life and you had 100x the chance of getting run over by a drunk driver even in the unusual circumstances yes, 'acktully' get the fuck out of your house and live your life or you are letting terror rule it. It's one thing to be in an active situation, run the fuck away but humans just arent good at parsing the probabilities of events like these on the scale of a country or even a city. I wish media was better at conveying these sorts of things, you're nearly as safe as you were just before goddamnit don't live in fear.

[IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAh40FXXsAEQ347.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/9j85RAM.png[/IMG] ...

A couple of my cousins were there, thankfully they weren't hurt, god this is so fucked.

[QUOTE=Nightfury;52267012][IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAh40FXXsAEQ347.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/9j85RAM.png[/IMG] ...[/QUOTE] Brianna Wu continues to be an attention seeking cunt. Ones of people shocked. She doesn't deserve the attention.

[QUOTE=Nightfury;52267012][IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAh40FXXsAEQ347.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/9j85RAM.png[/IMG] ...[/QUOTE] As if anyone needed more proof Wu is a lunatic

[QUOTE=Nightfury;52267012][IMG]https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DAh40FXXsAEQ347.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]http://i.imgur.com/9j85RAM.png[/IMG] ...[/QUOTE] This isn't about sexism, Brianna. Fuck right off you attention seeking bitch.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;52267049]Why quote and give more attention?[/QUOTE] Quoting it somewhere that won't give it more viral power doesn't really contribute to the problem.

[QUOTE=Trebgarta;52267017]Not all individuals' opinions matter. Can you remove that American nobody's tweets that serve no purpose?[/QUOTE] Well, too late for that since some quoted it here now.

[QUOTE=phygon;52267073]Quoting it somewhere that won't give it more viral power doesn't really contribute to the problem.[/QUOTE] My biggest post on tumblr with 200k notes (likes, reblogs) was some meme that came from lmaopics. Sharing things gives it viral power no matter what, because inevitably one person shows it to someone that will share it in a place that gets more attention. Trebgarta is right on this one [editline]23rd May 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=Jarokwa;52265136]gee, why am i not surprised.[/QUOTE] Because you let your confirmation bias dictate your opinions on entire ethnic identities.

[QUOTE=fruxodaily;52266601]Terrorist win the moment you decide you won't do something because it could be targetted[/QUOTE] They also win when you strip people rights in the name of safety.

[QUOTE=Duck M.;52267105]My biggest post on tumblr with 200k notes (likes, reblogs) was some meme that came from lmaopics. Sharing things gives it viral power no matter what, because inevitably one person shows it to someone that will share it in a place that gets more attention. [/QUOTE] That's a stupid reason to not discuss how dumb something is. A post making fun of someone's tweets does not help their popularity, and neither would a repost of said post.

Went to the pub last night. This attack has REALLY brought out the racism even in my lil friends group. Another thing, spoke to a police woman (part of Manchester team) and asked her about the "known to police thing". She said that its when they find a person and have evidence that the person is an extremist, they strongly suspect the person wants to carry out an attack but its not considered conspiracy to commit terrorism because the means, time and place haven't been established. If they take that person to court there is a big chance the person won't be sent down because there is no solid evidence against them. The police do not have the funding necessary to carry out the surveillance needed. One example she gave, without giving names, was some creep from luton who wanted to do an attack but because they had no solid evidence all they could do is use other laws to move him around. In this case move him away from luton to the manchester area (which is fucking terrifying) justification being if the guy is moved to a new area he is moved away from the place he wanted to bomb and separated from the people who radicalised him or the environment/situation which made him vulnerable to radicalisation in the first place. Interesting discussion and view points from a cop. Can any police here (hezzy?) confirm this? [editline]24th May 2017[/editline] Also lol at brianna wu using this to get attention and the anti sjw crowd using that to take a shot at sjws. Literally off topic garbage. [editline]24th May 2017[/editline] [QUOTE=kevinspacey;52266671]its great to see people who live in countries that have has close to 0 terror attacks and who dont leave their houses for the majority of their lives roll off hackneyed lines about terrorists winning give me a fucking break. This is the equivalent of you telling people they should jump off the back of their boats in waters where a great white was seen hunting 30 minutes earlier because "Acktully... statistically speaking..." [highlight](User was banned for this post ("Trolling" - Big Dumb American))[/highlight][/QUOTE] The terrorists hate what we have. Moreso they hate that they're not part of it. That's why the destroy it. It's like the messed up kids who shoot up schools. They're fucked in the head and desperate for some semblance of identity and success. Rather than adapt to fit into the system they find different systems. Radical islamism is a common one to adopt because its a fairly strong identity (clothing, meetings, prayer, giving stuff up = sacrifices = investment). A preacher will find someone who doesn't fit in, who is angry, who can't get girls, who others society for their problems, who hates stuff because they can't have it. They'll take that person and direct that hatred and contempt. All extremist groups do it. They prey on the weak and vulnerable, people who don't fit in. So if we change our society to stop it. If we remove our freedoms. If we live in fear. Then we are literally giving them what they want, they want to end this good thing we got going and they're going to try and make us do the ending. Like a fly in a shop, it can't do shit. But it can wind up a bull, keep landing on its eyes etc so the bull smashes the shop for it. You mention statistics. You are statistically unlikely to be directly affected by a terror attack but its so emotive and terrifying you are prompted to support actions which will directly affect you. You are the bull.

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;52268563]Went to the pub last night. This attack has REALLY brought out the racism even in my lil friends group. Another thing, spoke to a police woman (part of Manchester team) and asked her about the "known to police thing". She said that its when they find a person and have evidence that the person is an extremist, they strongly suspect the person wants to carry out an attack but its not considered conspiracy to commit terrorism because the means, time and place haven't been established. If they take that person to court there is a big chance the person won't be sent down because there is no solid evidence against them. The police do not have the funding necessary to carry out the surveillance needed. One example she gave, without giving names, was some creep from luton who wanted to do an attack but because they had no solid evidence all they could do is use other laws to move him around. In this case move him away from luton to the manchester area (which is fucking terrifying) justification being if the guy is moved to a new area he is moved away from the place he wanted to bomb and separated from the people who radicalised him or the environment/situation which made him vulnerable to radicalisation in the first place. Interesting discussion and view points from a cop. Can any police here (hezzy?) confirm this? [editline]24th May 2017[/editline] Also lol at brianna wu using this to get attention and the anti sjw crowd using that to take a shot at sjws. Literally off topic garbage. [editline]24th May 2017[/editline] The terrorists hate what we have. Moreso they hate that they're not part of it. That's why the destroy it. It's like the messed up kids who shoot up schools. They're fucked in the head and desperate for some semblance of identity and success. Rather than adapt to fit into the system they find different systems. Radical islamism is a common one to adopt because its a fairly strong identity (clothing, meetings, prayer, giving stuff up = sacrifices = investment). A preacher will find someone who doesn't fit in, who is angry, who can't get girls, who others society for their problems, who hates stuff because they can't have it. They'll take that person and direct that hatred and contempt. All extremist groups do it. They prey on the weak and vulnerable, people who don't fit in. So if we change our society to stop it. If we remove our freedoms. If we live in fear. Then we are literally giving them what they want, they want to end this good thing we got going and they're going to try and make us do the ending. Like a fly in a shop, it can't do shit. But it can wind up a bull, keep landing on its eyes etc so the bull smashes the shop for it. You mention statistics. You are statistically unlikely to be directly affected by a terror attack but its so emotive and terrifying you are prompted to support actions which will directly affect you. You are the bull.[/QUOTE] So radical islamists are jealous of what we have if they hate not being part of it, therefore they prefer what we have to what they have?

[QUOTE=mdeceiver79;52268563]Went to the pub last night. This attack has REALLY brought out the racism even in my lil friends group. Another thing, spoke to a police woman (part of Manchester team) and asked her about the "known to police thing". She said that its when they find a person and have evidence that the person is an extremist, they strongly suspect the person wants to carry out an attack but its not considered conspiracy to commit terrorism because the means, time and place haven't been established. If they take that person to court there is a big chance the person won't be sent down because there is no solid evidence against them. The police do not have the funding necessary to carry out the surveillance needed. One example she gave, without giving names, was some creep from luton who wanted to do an attack but because they had no solid evidence all they could do is use other laws to move him around. In this case move him away from luton to the manchester area (which is fucking terrifying) justification being if the guy is moved to a new area he is moved away from the place he wanted to bomb and separated from the people who radicalised him or the environment/situation which made him vulnerable to radicalisation in the first place. Interesting discussion and view points from a cop. Can any police here (hezzy?) confirm this? [editline]24th May 2017[/editline] Also lol at brianna wu using this to get attention and the anti sjw crowd using that to take a shot at sjws. Literally off topic garbage. [editline]24th May 2017[/editline] The terrorists hate what we have. Moreso they hate that they're not part of it. That's why the destroy it. It's like the messed up kids who shoot up schools. They're fucked in the head and desperate for some semblance of identity and success. Rather than adapt to fit into the system they find different systems. Radical islamism is a common one to adopt because its a fairly strong identity (clothing, meetings, prayer, giving stuff up = sacrifices = investment). A preacher will find someone who doesn't fit in, who is angry, who can't get girls, who others society for their problems, who hates stuff because they can't have it. They'll take that person and direct that hatred and contempt. All extremist groups do it. They prey on the weak and vulnerable, people who don't fit in. So if we change our society to stop it. If we remove our freedoms. If we live in fear. Then we are literally giving them what they want, they want to end this good thing we got going and they're going to try and make us do the ending. Like a fly in a shop, it can't do shit. But it can wind up a bull, keep landing on its eyes etc so the bull smashes the shop for it. You mention statistics. You are statistically unlikely to be directly affected by a terror attack but its so emotive and terrifying you are prompted to support actions which will directly affect you. You are the bull.[/QUOTE] Reading that post was a fucking trip, I don't know what to make of it "You are the bull" What the fuck are you talking about there man. Strong Identities? What

to tl'dr that rollercoaster ride of a post, i would take the meaning to be: extremists pray upon vulnerable people with problems in their lives, exploiting these problems to turn them into what they want putting forward draconian policy to deal with this doesn't work, because any oppressive policy simply creates the opportunity for more damaged, vulnerable people - this is why dealing with Islamic terrorism by oppressive muslims doesn't work terrorists are fundamentally incapable of doing actual damage to the UK, 22% of the number of people who died in this bombing, died in a car crash on the M6 this morning: terrorism is extremely statistically insignificant - however, the damage done by overreacting government policy is far more significant than any homemade shit bomb ever is basically the old adage of the cure being more damaging than the illness not reacting to terrorists with massive terror alerts etc is not "rolling over and letting the terrorists have their way", it's understanding that any irrational, reactionary action causes far more damage than a dude blowing himself up

[QUOTE=Jarokwa;52268741]some people prefer to be smart and play it safe for a little while. i dont care about "hurrdurr ur letign dem win" if it means i can keep my life and limbs intact lol.[/QUOTE] Even tho statistically that's very unlikely and your much more likely to die in many other situations. Especially in these situations it's very hard to pull off another attack with all the security measures being put in place

[QUOTE=Jarokwa;52268741]some people prefer to be smart and play it safe for a little while. i dont care about "hurrdurr ur letign dem win" if it means i can keep my life and limbs intact lol.[/QUOTE] A terrorist attack could happen at any time, you can't go around 'playing it safe' The next one might be in 40 years time or even in 1 hour, you have no idea and so by 'playing it safe' you're pushing their agenda. Your life and limbs will more likely rot off from you sitting in your house all day

[QUOTE=TrannyAlert;52268774]A terrorist attack could happen at any time, you can't go around 'playing it safe' The next one might be in 40 years time or even in 1 hour, you have no idea and so by 'playing it safe' you're pushing their agenda. Your life and limbs will more likely rot off from you sitting in your house all day[/QUOTE] Agree. That's why terrorists come up with newer unpredictable methods like using cars and trucks instead of guns and bombs, so they can create fear any time, anywhere (hypothetically). So restrictive measures simply won't work in the long term

There's not much you can do about terrorist attacks without restricting peoples lives to the limits and even then it just makes people think of craftier ideas. One of the reasons terrorist attacks continue is because we are giving them what they want. Fear and publicity

[QUOTE=TrannyAlert;52268780]There's not much you can do about terrorist attacks without restricting peoples lives to the limits and even then it just makes people think of craftier ideas. One of the reasons terrorist attacks continue is because we are giving them what they want. Fear and publicity[/QUOTE] You make a good point. Imagine a world where we decided to stop reporting terrorist attacks (obviously we can't), would the terrorists organisation even know about it?

[QUOTE=Cloak Raider;52268729]to tl'dr that rollercoaster ride of a post, i would take the meaning to be: extremists pray upon vulnerable people with problems in their lives, exploiting these problems to turn them into what they want putting forward draconian policy to deal with this doesn't work, because any oppressive policy simply creates the opportunity for more damaged, vulnerable people - this is why dealing with Islamic terrorism by oppressive muslims doesn't work terrorists are fundamentally incapable of doing actual damage to the UK, 22% of the number of people who died in this bombing, died in a car crash on the M6 this morning: terrorism is extremely statistically insignificant - however, the damage done by overreacting government policy is far more significant than any homemade shit bomb ever is basically the old adage of the cure being more damaging than the illness not reacting to terrorists with massive terror alerts etc is not "rolling over and letting the terrorists have their way", it's understanding that any irrational, reactionary action causes far more damage than a dude blowing himself up[/QUOTE] If we didn't have terror alerts then surely it would be easier for terrorists to do what they do? Normally a terror alert will come from intelligence received. I would be more inclined to trust our Govt with their anti-terror measures than an armchair expert on a forum.

[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52269565]If we didn't have terror alerts then surely it would be easier for terrorists to do what they do? Normally a terror alert will come from intelligence received. I would be more inclined to trust our Govt with their anti-terror measures than an armchair expert on a forum.[/QUOTE] Eroding the freedoms of the people ostensibly to capture terrorists just puts more power into the hands of the government over you lol, Theresa May has already introduced massive warrantless surveillance on people in general, and recently issued a document showing a blueprint to take over the internet access locally to control its content.

[QUOTE=Zonesylvania;52269577]Eroding the freedoms of the people ostensibly to capture terrorists just puts more power into the hands of the government over you lol, Theresa May has already introduced massive warrantless surveillance on people in general, and recently issued a document showing a blueprint to take over the internet access locally to control its content.[/QUOTE] So anyone from the UK please chime in listing how devastating these measures have impacted on your lives.

[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52269641]So anyone from the UK please chime in listing how devastating these measures have impacted on your lives.[/QUOTE] Are you going to tell me next that you have nothing to worry about if you have nothing to hide? :downs:

[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52269641]So anyone from the UK please chime in listing how devastating these measures have impacted on your lives.[/QUOTE] It's all well and good until someone inevitably hacks the fucking massive databases of everyone's metadata and browsing history, all of which is very powerful in the wrong hands.

[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52269641]So anyone from the UK please chime in listing how devastating these measures have impacted on your lives.[/QUOTE] I had to phone up my ISP last year to turn off the "Parental Controls" which the government mandated. For some inexplicable reason they activated without me pressing any buttons That was at least like 2 minutes of holding on a phone before spending 30 seconds talking to somebody. An outrage!

[QUOTE=UK Bohemian;52269641]So anyone from the UK please chime in listing how devastating these measures have impacted on your lives.[/QUOTE] Well they didn't prevent this terror attack. Restrictive measures don't work as terrorists will always try and find ways of causing mass terror and harm no matter the method, it's a cat and mouse game. Thats why restrictive measures may work in the short term, but the root causes of the problem need to be targeted.