Loot boxes have reached a new low with Forza 7’s “pay to earn” option - Sensationalist Headlines

[QUOTE=Kljunas;52732311]There's nothing wrong with giving players an option to skip parts of the game but that option should be a cheat code or game mode, not microtransactions.[/QUOTE] That ship sailed a long time ago. Haven't seen cheat codes in most games since 2006 or so.

[QUOTE=nintenman1;52733648]That ship sailed a long time ago. Haven't seen cheat codes in most games since 2006 or so.[/QUOTE] And when did DLC and online gaming start getting big? (hint Xbox 360 came out in November of 2005)

[QUOTE=Noob4life;52731371]This is mostly true for games with their entire business model based around microtransactions, notably f2p and multiplayer games. Singleplayer games would still require that players are able to reach end game within reasonable play time without paying up (for now). Of course, this is mostly done out of greed, but who is to say some weren't implemented as a form of tip jar? Lootboxes are the culprit here, those are the ones that enable gambling habits. Let's be real here, microtransactions and lootboxes earn publishers money, they are not going away for the time being. Might as well start seeing what form of implementation is the most acceptable and least anti-consumer. Don't judge games simply by the presence of microtransactions.[/QUOTE] I'll continue to judge singleplayer experiences by the existence of microtransactions because I have other options if one is unacceptable. I don't [i]need[/i] to play Shadow Of War, and because of stuff like this I won't, because it has no place in the game. You're giving publishers way, way too much credit with arguing that it could just be a "tip jar". This isn't an ice cream parlor, there's no cashier serving you the game. The manager has offered you a $60 product, and is now asking for tips to skip the rock hard shell on the outside and get to the good part. Publishers have been shown to be absolutely ready to fuck over consumers in the past if they feel they can get away with it, see garbage like "DLC Cheat Codes", Always online singleplayer games, and predatory pre-ordering schemes like Mankind Divided. Singleplayer games don't "have" to require anything, because there's always going to be the rabid fans of the series that defend any decision made. Game seems a bit too long and grindy without lootboxes? You're just a "casual" and the game isn't meant for you (See: Nier automata posts about the first level of the game being fairly difficult and without a single checkpoint). Publishers don't "deserve" any benefit of the doubt because they're companies that exist to make money, and when people believe they're acting in the interest of the consumer, that's how these practices become normalized. There are some hills not worth dying on, like the removal of cheat codes from games, due simply to alternatives being available for my platform of choice (PC). But Trying to justify any sort of "gamble to skip gameplay" in a full priced $60 AAA single-player game is absolutely ridiculous and an obvious sign of greed in attempting to take advantage of loyal customers.

I loathe microtransactions. I hated them the moment I laid my eyes on them ever since I was a kid. But what I realize is that microtransaction is the most powerful monetization tool right now, and it by itself has spawned an entire market of absolutely disgusting, unregulated pool that manipulate ill-willed audiences. Now what I feared has happened, it creeping into this big, beautiful side of the industry. I don't support it. Many devs don't care for it. But the business side demands it because it makes them more money. I have speculated that, unless a governing body steps in to put a stop to this, no single man or small angry mob will stop it. It is the inevidable bad future. Distancing myself from such disgusting practices would mean missing out all the other beautiful aspect of video games. With more and more companies taking this approach, sooner or later, we would have little to none to choose from. I implore that we begin adopting the lesser devil. Learn what is within acceptable range and what is not, rather than stereotypically dismiss all with the m-word tagged to it. We can live in the old world where cheat codes and complete games were a thing, but if we, as vocal minortiy, don't move on and adapt to the new environment, we should just move out of AAA gaming as a whole. This isn't a protest we can realistically win unless it gets really, really ugly. I still fucking hate microtransactions and loot boxes. But I don't want a small tumor to ruin the better side of gaming. I can't speak for anyone but this is the only reason I defend microtransaction at all, and rarely anybody defend microtransactions because it almost never directly benefits the consumer.

[QUOTE=Noob4life;52734522]I loathe microtransactions. I hated them the moment I laid my eyes on them ever since I was a kid. But what I realize is that microtransaction is the most powerful monetization tool right now, and it by itself has spawned an entire market of absolutely disgusting, unregulated pool that manipulate ill-willed audiences. Now what I feared has happened, it creeping into this big, beautiful side of the industry. I don't support it. Many devs don't care for it. But the business side demands it because it makes them more money. I have speculated that, unless a governing body steps in to put a stop to this, no single man or small angry mob will stop it. It is the inevidable bad future. Distancing myself from such disgusting practices would mean missing out all the other beautiful aspect of video games. With more and more companies taking this approach, sooner or later, we would have little to none to choose from. I implore that we begin adopting the lesser devil. Learn what is within acceptable range and what is not, rather than stereotypically dismiss all with the m-word tagged to it. We can live in the old world where cheat codes and complete games were a thing, but if we, as vocal minortiy, don't move on and adapt to the new environment, we should just move out of AAA gaming as a whole. This isn't a protest we can realistically win unless it gets really, really ugly. I still fucking hate microtransactions and loot boxes. But I don't want a small tumor to ruin the better side of gaming. I can't speak for anyone but this is the only reason I defend microtransaction at all, and rarely anybody defend microtransactions because it almost never directly benefits the consumer.[/QUOTE] It doesn't need government intervention. It needs gamers to express self-control and not buy games that abuse microtransactions. I've been a fan of the Forza franchise for many years, since the Xbox 360 days, and the only reason I have an XB1 is for Forza games. But I'm not buying Forza 7. I am not going to support the precedent for what could potentially be a rather nasty microtransaction system. But I'm not going to buy the game for other reasons too, eg 1 new track to the franchise and less than 2 dozen new cars to the franchise (most just new liveries for existing race cars) is absolutely pathetic. So, as a long-time Forza fan, instead of getting Forza 7, I've taken my money elsewhere; I am buying GT Sport, which will not have microtransactions. If I didn't have a PS4, I'd get Project Cars 2 instead. If enough people boycott things like what Forza 7 is doing, Turn 10 and Microsoft will be forced to respond if they are going to keep on making sales.

Hope that decision meant something (you did mention it is a very weak installment), and not an ammo for microtransactions being capable of recouping "lost sales".

[QUOTE=BanterChicken;52733623]They had this loot box thing disguised as a spin to win in Forza Horizon 3, as far as I know you can just use skill-points or you would have to level up to do it though. I don't think it's bad as long as they let you still earn them with in-game currency. You most likely are able to get the car you want from the auction house for really cheap anyways.. it's how I used to get all my vehicles in FH3 pre-upgraded.[/QUOTE] But that wasn't a way for them to get money, it was just part of the game, you couldn't spend money on the spin to win

[QUOTE=BF;52734562]It doesn't need government intervention. It needs gamers to express self-control and not buy games that abuse microtransactions.[/QUOTE] This is the key. People always talk about how loot boxes in Overwatch are exploitative and ruinous for the game industry. But I don't buy them and I can still enjoy the game just fine? It's not like it ruins my game somehow. I view microtransactions like that as akin to blind bags, trading cards, and Loot Crates (as in the physical ones you buy a subscription for.) You don't know what you're getting, you're popping money in for the hope of getting something cool that you can then collect, use, or resell (except you can't really resell skins in Overwatch last I checked.) And those are totally fine by me. It's the consumer's responsibility to not waste all their money on them, not the manufacturer's. If you don't like something, don't buy it. Just stop going "Man, Overwatch is ruining gaming! But I gotta get this legendary epic skin that affects nothing about the gameplay except perhaps making me an easier target! Curse you Blizzard!"

We're at the point where people are relieved when theres microtransactions if they're not in a lootbox. The AAA gaming industry is just a cycle of "introduce something bad" -> "get negative pushback" -> "push it hard" -> "introduce something worse" -> "people prefer and start defending old thing", it happened with DLC instead of big expansion packs, then again with microtransactions instead of DLC. I wonder what they'll come up with next.