What developers and Steam users think about paid mods on the Steam Workshop

[Zombie Strider]

In a sense the TF2 community (and dota 2) has been doing this for years. Hats get approved and then approved to be purchased in game. Its modders getting paid for their work.
The primary difference between that I guess is that there is a much higher quality control in the former, but I'm not sure how the current mods are controlled.
Everyone is mostly freaking out because it doesn't affect them positively, only the modders and valve.
Personally, I think its not great and instead they should have just added a button to be able to donate from your steam wallet, because thats what it seems to be at the moment with the "Pay what you want"

[Unknown]

The problems I have with this has nothing to do with individual mods, but rather the system as a whole, and the mindset it creates. Modding thrives when different people can easily build upon one another's work because it allows each modder to make the best use of their limited time. This, even without bringing money into the picture, doesn't always happen; GTA IV modding, for example, is full of locked down, closed source, "exclusive", etc... mods. Not to say all of them are, of course, but I would say the majority are.

That's without money even being a factor; add that in and it isn't just about ego or whatever anymore, it's that and money. Why make guides, release tools, open source projects, etc... when someone might build upon (or directly use) that to cut into "your" market?

To some people this change won't matter, of course; there will still be people out there who do it just because they love modding a game. However, introducing money into what is already at times a toxic environment isn't going to make it better; it isn't going to encourage cooperation.

Perhaps the counter argument to this is that now more people will get involved and there will be more mods; that I'm sure is true, but "more" and "better" are not the same. Moreover, with creators only seeing 25% of the profits, it's doubtful very many people would be able to make a living off of modding, and those who could would most likely be able to find a job making far more.

So, no, "you don't have to buy a mod if you don't want to" isn't the point; the point is the addition of money changes how people look at things, and how people act. In something like modding where, for many games, it is through a community effort that so many good mods are made, such a change is damaging.

This change, from my point of view, doesn't have a positive impact on mod makers, nor consumers of mods, or the modding community as a whole. It only has a positive impact on Valve's and the game developer's pocket books.

[AntonioR]

I never bought Gmod because I didn't want to, so I don't know how much its success is based on other peoples free work and mods ?

Also I wonder if Minecraft would take off like that if everyone was charging few bucks for their mods, texture packs, etc...

Wasn't DayZ a free mod for Arma 2 before it became a standalone game ? I doubt it would took off so fast if they charged money for it.

The list goes on...

[Markka]

Few people seem to have considered the massive cost to the customer this change has the potential to cause. I'll quote a post I made in another very similiar thread since this one seems to have a few more eyeballs on it, and hope that's not against the rules.

[QUOTE=Markka;47591157]This will make modding your game(s) prohibitively expensive, assuming a large portion (+40-60%) of worthwhile mods go pay-to-use. Say you drop 40-60€ on a game like Skyrim, which will then get an X number of mods. At least in my experience, most mods tend to be fairly piecemeal and change a specific aspect of a game. Total conversions and overhauls are quite bit different beasties. Ignoring vast mods you only might require one or two of at a time, what will the cost of modding your game be from now on? Let's say that you're running 50 mods, or perhaps 100 mods, or even more if you're heavily into modding and tweaking your game. And let's assume that on average one of these mods costs 1€. You will end up paying double, triple of even more of what the game initially cost you. I don't see this being a sustainable model for mods, not in a million years. It's simply too expensive and will likely therefore discourage people from modding games.

While I of course agree with modders getting paid for their work on principle, I don't see any other way but a donation model working. Personally, I will never pay for a mod, and if in the future majority of mods will become paid for, I will simply opt out of modding. I imagine many people share my attitude, and I fear this will do severe damage to the modding scene.[/QUOTE]

Myself I'm already very stingy, and this change towards paid for mods seems like insanity, as it has the potential to double the cost of a game like Skyrim if you want to have more bells and whistles in it. The "pay what you want" model is better than a straigth-up paywall, but even that I see as being a bad thing if you have to pay for the mod up front. The mod could end up not working later down the line, or perhaps you just dislike it, or perhaps it sets your computer on fire. The 24 hour refund period isn't going to do much good for you either, unless you get your hands on the mod's content very quickly and manage to experience it to a satisfactory degree during that refund period.

[HoodedSniper]

[QUOTE=Handsome Matt;47585754]oh my god who cares, nobody is forcing you to buy it, but if a creator wants to charge for something, why shouldn't they be able to![/QUOTE]

This is and will always be the dumbest god damn argument vs this type of shit.

[Elspin]

[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;47591597]This is and will always be the dumbest god damn argument vs this type of shit.[/QUOTE]

It's certainly not as bad as the opposing argument which is essentially "people were making stuff for me for free and I'm angry because I want people to keep making things for free for me". The way I see it, the content creators are the only people who should have any say in this. If they don't want to monetize their mods? That's great! I occasionally make mods and standalone programs myself and I've never charged for it, so I don't really see myself doing so, but if they want to that's [b]their[/b] choice.

[HoodedSniper]

[QUOTE=Elspin;47591705]It's certainly not as bad as the opposing argument which is essentially "people were making stuff for me for free and I'm angry because I want people to keep making things for free for me". The way I see it, the content creators are the only people who should have any say in this. If they don't want to monetize their mods? That's great! I occasionally make mods and standalone programs myself and I've never charged for it, so I don't really see myself doing so, but if they want to that's [B]their[/B] choice.[/QUOTE]

"people were making stuff for me for free and I'm angry because I want people to keep making things for free for me"

If this is how you see it then you are seeing it completely wrong. No content creators SHOULDNT be the only ones to say anything in this matter because literally any fucking idiot can be one these days. I can load up the content creator, import a model of shit, and sell it for $5. That does not mean im fucking ANYONE worth listening to. As is the VAST VAST VAST majority of any content creators and even "game" developers.

Theirs SO much more too this as well dude that you clearly arent taking into account.

Early access mods are already a fucking thing

You could pay for a broken mod that breaks your game, you only have 24 hours for a refund atm.

Valve takes 75%, fucking 75%.

Absolutely 0 quality control.

Stealing other mods and selling them is already happening.

Pirating mods is now an actual thing in vocabulary.

The argument here IS NOT about if selling mods is good or bad, the argument is against how Valve is handling it so fucking poorly.

No one is mad Black Mesa now gets to sell itself even though its just a mod, thats the type of shit that SHOULD be happening.

Not selling stolen nexus shit for $1. The quality control for this is so fucking bad even compared to green light that it blows my fucking mind Valve actually went through with this.

Also Valve knows exactly what they are pulling here. 75% cut? yeah they are being scummy as fuck.

[Elspin]

[QUOTE=HoodedSniper;47591768]"people were making stuff for me for free and I'm angry because I want people to keep making things for free for me"

If this is how you see it then you are seeing it completely wrong. No content creators SHOULDNT be the only ones to say anything in this matter because literally any fucking idiot can be one these days. I can load up the content creator, import a model of shit, and sell it for $5. That does not mean im fucking ANYONE worth listening to. As is the VAST VAST VAST majority of any content creators and even "game" developers.[/QUOTE]

No, I'm really not, my statement is as close to fact as an opinion can possibly be. If you made something and it's legal to sell it it's your choice and your choice alone if you want to do so, keyboard warriors who want it for free do not get an opinion on it in any other medium. What you're even trying to prove by saying you can upload a model of shit and try and sell it for $5 is indecipherable.

[QUOTE]Theirs SO much more too this as well dude that you clearly arent taking into account.

Early access mods are already a fucking thing

You could pay for a broken mod that breaks your game, you only have 24 hours for a refund atm.[/QUOTE]

If you're concerned about the quality of a mod that you can probably download in 5 minutes and you then decide to not try it for 24 hours how is it anyone's fault but your own

[QUOTE]Valve takes 75%, fucking 75%. [/QUOTE]

I already voiced my concern with this, I think the cut is bullshit but I don't necessarily think the system is a bad idea because of that.

[QUOTE]Absolutely 0 quality control.[/QUOTE]

Same as above, Valve does need to pre-approve things as far as I can tell so they should really be doing better on this

[QUOTE]Stealing other mods and selling them is already happening.

Pirating mods is now an actual thing in vocabulary.[/QUOTE]

There's been one reported case and it was pulled and refunds were given.

[QUOTE]The argument here IS NOT about if selling mods is good or bad, the argument is against how Valve is handling it so fucking poorly.

No one is mad Black Mesa now gets to sell itself even though its just a mod, thats the type of shit that SHOULD be happening.

Not selling stolen nexus shit for $1. The quality control for this is so fucking bad even compared to green light that it blows my fucking mind Valve actually went through with this.

Also Valve knows exactly what they are pulling here. 75% cut? yeah they are being scummy as fuck.[/QUOTE]

"People are going to abuse it" is not a good argument against a system, and you're doing very little to disguise that you're just mad you might have to pay for a mod you want now. To be very clear: I do think the system needs a lot of work (ie the pay cut is bullshit yes), I just don't necessarily think it's a bad thing at all.

[HoodedSniper]

[QUOTE=Elspin;47591900]No, I'm really not, my statement is as close to fact as an opinion can possibly be. If you made something and it's legal to sell it it's your choice and your choice alone if you want to do so, keyboard warriors who want it for free do not get an opinion on it in any other medium. What you're even trying to prove by saying you can upload a model of shit and try and sell it for $5 is indecipherable.

If you're concerned about the quality of a mod that you can probably download in 5 minutes and you then decide to not try it for 24 hours how is it anyone's fault but your own

I already voiced my concern with this, I think the cut is bullshit but I don't necessarily think the system is a bad idea because of that.

Same as above, Valve does need to pre-approve things as far as I can tell so they should really be doing better on this

There's been one reported case and it was pulled and refunds were given.

"People are going to abuse it" is not a good argument against a system, and you're doing very little to disguise that you're just mad you might have to pay for a mod you want now. To be very clear: I do think the system needs a lot of work (ie the pay cut is bullshit yes), I just don't necessarily think it's a bad thing at all.[/QUOTE]

ONE reported case in mere hours after the release, doesnt bold well in the future.

"If you're concerned about the quality of a mod that you can probably download in 5 minutes and you then decide to not try it for 24 hours how is it anyone's fault but your own"

Once again this is not the point, the point is buying a working mod, then they update it or something happens and its completely broken and the guy who made it does fuck all anymore so NOW my mod is worthless, broken, wont be fixed, and no refund.

"and you're doing very little to disguise that you're just mad you might have to pay for a mod you want now."

Now this is just being smarmy and projecting or some shit, im not mad I might have to pay for a mod I might want now, want to know why? I wont ever buy a mod unless its something full blown and massive and worthwhile. Like Black Mesa. I can live without $1 sword remodel #23423423423 or lel randumb bullshit.

Once again, no one is saying its a bad thing overall which is what you seem to think, its that this entire system Valve has made is fucking horrible and not the way to do it. So stop projecting shit into people as if they are mad they have to pay for mods when its more of the fact how shitty the entire system Valve made is.

Its not an argument about selling or buying mods, its about HOW the system in which buying and selling them is made.