• Why is World of Warcraft losing subscribers, and how can Blizzard fix it?
    81 replies, posted
[QUOTE=uitham;40594405]And with this I mean stuff like guilds being able to take over smaller cities for their faction and you will have to defend it against players and npcs taking it back[/QUOTE] I'd say look into Guild Wars 2's "World vs World vs World" system. Three servers fighting over a number of maps, guilds can claim (and therefore give buffs/bonuses to people in/around) different areas from little supply camps to a massive castle in the center of it all. Very involving to maintain dominance in that. As far as NPCs, there's a small population out there that kind of occupies locations and helps in mini-events, but there's that kind of stuff going in the end-game-ish zones with various camps and shrines to open up and gain access to rare supplies and merchant items. I think if blizzard wanted to, they could pull this stuff off pretty well in their own flavors. I'd be pretty interested
[QUOTE=daijitsu;40594541]I'd say look into Guild Wars 2's "World vs World vs World" system. Three servers fighting over a number of maps, guilds can claim (and therefore give buffs/bonuses to people in/around) different areas from little supply camps to a massive castle in the center of it all. Very involving to maintain dominance in that. As far as NPCs, there's a small population out there that kind of occupies locations and helps in mini-events, but there's that kind of stuff going in the end-game-ish zones with various camps and shrines to open up and gain access to rare supplies and merchant items. I think if blizzard wanted to, they could pull this stuff off pretty well in their own flavors. I'd be pretty interested[/QUOTE] I agree that world PvP should be brought back and not just in the way of capturing some shitty towers or whatever that provide bonuses. It's also kind of sad that the guards are so overpowered at high levels that barely anybody attacks the opposite faction's towns anymore
[QUOTE=daijitsu;40594541]I'd say look into Guild Wars 2's "World vs World vs World" system. Three servers fighting over a number of maps, guilds can claim (and therefore give buffs/bonuses to people in/around) different areas from little supply camps to a massive castle in the center of it all. Very involving to maintain dominance in that. As far as NPCs, there's a small population out there that kind of occupies locations and helps in mini-events, but there's that kind of stuff going in the end-game-ish zones with various camps and shrines to open up and gain access to rare supplies and merchant items. I think if blizzard wanted to, they could pull this stuff off pretty well in their own flavors. I'd be pretty interested[/QUOTE] I agree that world PvP should be brought back and not just in the way of capturing some shitty towers or whatever that provide bonuses. It's also kind of sad that the guards are so overpowered at high levels that barely anybody attacks the opposite faction's towns anymore
[QUOTE=daijitsu;40594541]I'd say look into Guild Wars 2's "World vs World vs World" system. Three servers fighting over a number of maps, guilds can claim (and therefore give buffs/bonuses to people in/around) different areas from little supply camps to a massive castle in the center of it all. Very involving to maintain dominance in that. As far as NPCs, there's a small population out there that kind of occupies locations and helps in mini-events, but there's that kind of stuff going in the end-game-ish zones with various camps and shrines to open up and gain access to rare supplies and merchant items. I think if blizzard wanted to, they could pull this stuff off pretty well in their own flavors. I'd be pretty interested[/QUOTE] I agree that world PvP should be brought back and not just in the way of capturing some shitty towers or whatever that provide bonuses. It's also kind of sad that the guards are so overpowered at high levels that barely anybody attacks the opposite faction's towns anymore
The only way they can fix it is by changing to a entirely new game engine because they are restricted mechanic wise for boss fights.
They need a stronger metagame. There's nothing they can add to what's already established that will make it more interesting. Take a page out of EVE's book, or Day Z, or anything else that gives way to emergent gameplay. Make a whole 'nother continent. Call it something cool. Put absolutely ZERO civilization on it, just resources and monsters, and let the Horde and Alliance build their own civilizations and fight over territory. You could really bring back that sense of accomplishment that was missing from progressing in WoW for the past few years doing that.
it used to be fun. It felt like it was the king of all games but just like a king it always goes down.
There's only so many ways you can make a "get out of the fire/aoe/cleave/replace boss ability here" before it gets stale...
[QUOTE=A Glitch;40596273]There's only so many ways you can make a "get out of the fire/aoe/cleave/replace boss ability here" before it gets stale...[/QUOTE] I'd like to take this opportunity to thank deadly boss mods for letting me know fire burns all these years
It's 9 years old, stale as fuck, still requires $15 a month, and ruined it's own lore with motorbikes and pandas.
its not that it's 'too old' or 'stale' it's just that the dumbfuck devs ruined it incrementally over the years with shit like removing talent trees, combining all of the class buffs so no one class is unique or needed, forcing people to do dailies as if they're fun or something, making travel trivial and the open world pointless not to mention instanced, and destroying community and human-interaction
wow I didn't think they nerfed it that bad, I left around the time cata came out and things were getting pretty fluffed already
I have fond memories of WoW, I remember going to friend's houses and having them over and playing together doing dungeons and dailies together. I still want to get the new expansion, but I just don't have the time to play anymore that I used to have. Well correction, I do have the time, but that would neglect all other games I like to play. I'd say make WoW F2P, but part of me thinks Blizzard would fuck the transition up somehow.
[QUOTE=Pelican;40593317] Best case scenario is that blizzard pull a jagex - they release an <expansion> server, whether it be vanilla BC or wrath, it will make their subs absolutely skyrocket to most likely the highest in their history[/QUOTE] whats the point to playing it then? right now the point of playing is to get as good as possible till the next piece of content comes out. if you just had the same content over and over again the game would get far more boring once the nostalgia wears off. there would be no point to playing because you could essentially just finish the game.
[QUOTE=Barbarian887;40596641]its not that it's 'too old' or 'stale' it's just that the dumbfuck devs ruined it incrementally over the years with shit like removing talent trees, combining all of the class buffs so no one class is unique or needed, forcing people to do dailies as if they're fun or something, making travel trivial and the open world pointless not to mention instanced, and destroying community and human-interaction[/QUOTE] They removed talent trees because talent trees weren't doing their job. It was supposed to be about character customization but the reality was there were two specs: the right one, and the wrong one. They combined class buffs because they want to bring good players, not classes. Being forced to sub out other classes for a shaman just to make a fight easier was a big problem in TBC. They never forced people to do dailies I'll give you trivializing travel and de-empasizing the open world, but nothing was instanced. The closest you got was phases. I dunno if you played solo on a bad server or what, but I never felt like the community got worse or better. Maybe it's because I was on a more popular server and in a guild. [QUOTE=Inspector Jones;40597276] I'd say make WoW F2P, but part of me thinks Blizzard would fuck the transition up somehow.[/QUOTE] And also no reason whatsoever to make it truly F2P. If they drop down to 2 million subscribers, hell, 1 million, they will still be the most subscribed-to MMORPG around. If Warhammer Online, Rift, EVE, etc can survive on sub 1 million numbers I'm sure WoW can. Especially considering that, by that point, Titan will likely be released. [editline]10th May 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=daijitsu;40594541]I'd say look into Guild Wars 2's "World vs World vs World" system. Three servers fighting over a number of maps, guilds can claim (and therefore give buffs/bonuses to people in/around) different areas from little supply camps to a massive castle in the center of it all. Very involving to maintain dominance in that. As far as NPCs, there's a small population out there that kind of occupies locations and helps in mini-events, but there's that kind of stuff going in the end-game-ish zones with various camps and shrines to open up and gain access to rare supplies and merchant items. I think if blizzard wanted to, they could pull this stuff off pretty well in their own flavors. I'd be pretty interested[/QUOTE] They already tried a smaller scale version of this with Wintergrasp and Tol Barad. Wintergrasp lasted awhile because it was actually somewhat useful to hold, but Tol Barad died as soon as the next content patch came out because no one wanted to play grabass with towers when they could just do battlegrounds and arena for the PVP gear or just drop into dungeon finder for PVE gear. It's not a strictly exact comparison but since Mists decided to drop it I'm going to guess that Blizzard just figured the WoW playerbase in general just really doesn't care about "world PVP" and just focused resources elsewhere. [editline]10th May 2013[/editline] [QUOTE=StickyNade;40595773]Take a page out of EVE's book, or Day Z, or anything else that gives way to emergent gameplay.[/QUOTE] I keep seeing people name-drop EVE or going on about emergent gameplay and I have to wonder how aware they are of the MMO market right now. The most popular games are themepark MMO's where content is developer-driven. This is a fact. SWTOR, Rift, GW2, and WoW are far more popular and ergo successful than EVE Online and games like Darkfall and Mortal Online. That's not to say those games are necessarily better; I love EVE and I'm playing it right now while neglecting WoW. It's just not a rule that these games are always the best ways to make a game, and in terms of attracting players (other than EVE with it's niche and near-monopoly on the sandbox market) are generally inferior to the themepark style games.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;40599432]They removed talent trees because talent trees weren't doing their job. It was supposed to be about character customization but the reality was there were two specs: the right one, and the wrong one. They combined class buffs because they want to bring good players, not classes. Being forced to sub out other classes for a shaman just to make a fight easier was a big problem in TBC. They never forced people to do dailies I'll give you trivializing travel and de-empasizing the open world, but nothing was instanced. The closest you got was phases. I dunno if you played solo on a bad server or what, but I never felt like the community got worse or better. Maybe it's because I was on a more popular server and in a guild. [/QUOTE] 1. Removing customization all together was not the right move, they should have just expanded them and fixed them to not be right spec/wrong spec 2. This type of game should work like a puzzle, combine the right classes and specs and get the most optimal result for a given encounter 3. if you don't do them you won't get the needed rep for shoulder enchants and gear to enter raids 4. The phase shit is what i was referring to, and it's terrible, and makes it hard to quest with other people, since they have to happen to be on the exact same page as you in the quest line.
[QUOTE=Barbarian887;40600048] 4. The phase shit is what i was referring to, and it's terrible, and makes it hard to quest with other people, since they have to happen to be on the exact same page as you in the quest line.[/QUOTE] The phasing isn't as bad as you're making it out to be. At least it feels like you make an impact on the world with your constant questing and monster slaying and it's only a few zones that are heavily instanced, mostly because they play a major role in the storyline and their environment is drastically changing. You make it sound like if you do some level 5 shit quest in a starting zone you will never be able to see anyone ever who isn't on that quest when it's not like that at all. Phasing also saved low pop servers from a hell of stagnation. Now you're guaranteed to get a massive group of people at a World Boss and for me, player interaction has skyrocketed. You know the pettiest thing that irks me is that they removed having to go to your class trainer to learn your new skills. It's an mmorpg and the little things like that, that they have removed is just plain odd.
[i]I really love coming home from my 8-hour shift, sitting down at my computer and spending another six hours grinding the shit out of my character to keep up with everyone else who also just got home from work and are settling down to a non-stop evening of WoW.[/i] I think it gradually caught onto us that it was a bit retarded to come home from work and pay to work essentially a second job.
My experience was more:[I] I really love coming home from my 8 hour shift, sitting down at my computer, and spending another few hours shooting the shit with my friends and killing dragons and maybe some Alliance d-bags later on. [/I]
The game is almost 10 years old. I was in the fucking [b]FILE PLANET BETA[/b]. That should tell you how old it is. People want fluid gameplay. People want the sandbox experience. People don't want more of the same which we've had for the past 10 years. I bet a lot of those accounts are people that don't check their billing statements "oh shit I'm still paying $15 for a game I haven't played in over a year or two!"
[QUOTE=Daniel M;40614586] I bet a lot of those accounts are people that don't check their billing statements "oh shit I'm still paying $15 for a game I haven't played in over a year or two!"[/QUOTE] Alternatively it could still be people who play WoW because nothing better has come out. [editline]12th May 2013[/editline] nothing better in terms of theme park dungeon crawling fantasy MMORPG's.
[QUOTE=Chrille;40593100]The game is old. Release a sequel or give it a vast overhaul that's essentially a new game in itself.[/QUOTE] There is a problem if they do a graphics overhaul and such stuff because the people at my school that play it don't have desktops, they only use the shitty spec school laptops that can barely play it as it is now, if they were to enhance it all of them would be unable to play it because all those millions go on 7-10 year old hardware.
[QUOTE=A Glitch;40596273]There's only so many ways you can make a "get out of the fire/aoe/cleave/replace boss ability here" before it gets stale...[/QUOTE] to give them some credit the boss mechanics aren't always exactly the same, they've been a lot more adventurous with the new bosses
I stopped playing because I can't play at the own pace I want to. New MMO's without subscription fees are awesome because I can jump in and out when I want and enjoy new additional content.
[QUOTE=Raidyr;40614597]Alternatively it could still be people who play WoW because nothing better has come out. [editline]12th May 2013[/editline] nothing better in terms of theme park dungeon crawling fantasy MMORPG's.[/QUOTE] one of the biggest problems I've seen with other games coming and going is that the WoW community does two things: Blames the other game for trying to be a WoW clone, then bashes it for not being enough like WoW to get WoW players to play it. I'll give it that a lot of games wanted to be WoW 2.0, some even labeled themselves WoW killers (big mistake), but it all boiled down to the fact that most hardcore MMO fans were knowledgeable about WoW, continued to play it, and with or without reason always put things side by side to compare with a bias, treating the new product like it's a foreign invader coming to kill your nostalgia. I played WoW for a good while, I tried a number of other games and those came and went, [i]but I had fun with them and the reason I usually left was because my friends found something else to play, so I followed them around[/i], which is one of the huge reasons people still stick to WoW- they've built a community there, they stick around and shoot the shit. It's actually personal to them, not just preference, and that's fine.
There are a billion reasons someone could say why WoW is losing subscribers. I personally think it's a culmination of dumbing down and people's friends slowly stop playing it, giving a person less of a reason to continue playing it. But in the end, no game will reign forever, and WoW is at the point where it's inevitably falling out of popularity.
I'd personally resub if they return to the gothic medieval/cartoonish futuristic/lovecraftian mishmash theme they had Pandaria really fucking sucks because it doesn't have any of that and I went from being "wooray warcraft" to "hoot hoot i am in japan" The game is fun, the lore is good, the combat is semi decent, but everything else is outdated, there are no player customization/personal things such as housing or trophy halls or whatever It's just really outdated They need to bring it back to 2010+ and then return to their original theming and I'm in And atleast 45ish friends of mine would be too. Also I want WotLK talents and everything else This fucking talent system sucks balls and so does the fucking game thanks to it Sure I'll have some special spells at certain level landmarks but FUCK YOUR STUPID TALENT SYSTEM
I'd probably play again if they removed the sub fee and just had a straight one-time fee of $30.
how about a old school kind of server that brings back the level cap to 60?
[QUOTE=Dyneskye;40632039]how about a old school kind of server that brings back the level cap to 60?[/QUOTE] I'm pretty sure there's a lot of people who privately host 'vanilla' servers, probably other expansion-capped ones as well
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