bad bad admins, the right to abuse

Anyone with disposable income and some general smarts can bring a server online.
This is free world entitlement.

There are good admins and bad.

Just make it that there are one or two free admin ONLY accts that DO NOT play as newmans. Like Microsoft’s server admin accts.

If they use their standard acct they are just like all of us. No admin powers that can tempt them to abuse.

Of course, I can always move to another server or start my own, but why mingle admin powers with gameplay other than lazy convenience. Once a playing server owner pops into admin mode in the console, they suspend playing.

Then do that and stop trying to restrict what other people do with the things THEY’RE paying for. Why should they have to spend time coding unneeded restrictions in for server owners other than lazy convenience for you to not have to find another server or start your own?

Here another perspective for you, from an admin.

First off, complete honesty here. I use my powers and give myself A LOT. I haven’t farmed for anything or crafted a single thing since I gained the ability to call items into existence. What do I do with my power? Build. I build myself a base and usually some fun structures for the server to enjoy ie: Mayan Temple, Battle Arena, Bridges… Those kinds of things.

What a lot of people who yell admin abuse don’t realize is, running a server, properly that is, giving it the attention it needs with proper rules and conduct, completely ruins my ability to play and enjoy the game as all the people in my server can. I can’t go more then an hour in my server without having to stop what I’m doing and tend to the needs of my players. If there is accusations of hacking or glitching I have to kill myself. Did you know that our ability to go into spectate mode requires us to kill our self? Imagine I’m playing the game right, I’ve been farming for two hours and someone starts hacking in my server. There goes all my work, gone. I have strict rules for myself here though. Do I raid? Not one bit, that would be completely unfair. Do I run around the map with 10 AK’s and thousands of rounds blasting people? No. Because that would be unfair. Every wipe is pretty much me just building and babysitting.

Don’t get me wrong here, I enjoy having a server. This isn’t me complaining. This is me helping people realize that being an admin isn’t all fun and games full of abusing our powers. There are reasons we are given the powers we are given.

I do agree with you that it’s not hard at all to bring a server online. What IS hard is the challenge for players to find a server where the admin is helpful, HAS rules, enforces them and takes care of their players needs.

bump …i agree

Well put and I agree, there are good admins.
What is refreshing is that you didn’t once mention the right to do what you please as a server owner like DAGn did. That is what I am trying to address.

There are several servers where a group of admins LOL their way through the server. You know, the growing number of asshole admins ruining it for others. I guess I should take DAGn’s advise and pay for a server and take out my frustrations on the trusting gamers who join. After all, it is my right as a server owner (sarcasm abound)

Let owners admin the server, but not as a player, that’s all.

Anyways, such is the way. Just trying to improve the end user experience where possible.

They’d just install Oxide plugins that’d give them all those powers, anyways, and worse.

It’s their server, they paid for it, find another server. It’s a model that’s worked for almost everywhere, and you have not made a compelling argument as to why it has to be treated differently here other than you don’t want to have to switch servers if you find out the admin’s 12.

This thread’s unfolded exactly the same way it has in each of the 2,428 other threads made about admin abuse here.

Way to put words in my mouth. Never once did I give any advice beyond “If you don’t like it, move servers or start your own so you can be sure it’s admin’d how you like.”

In case you forgot, admins are end users as well. They have to stop whatever they’re doing as it is, possibly losing hours of work, to take care of problems and all you’re proposing is making that an even bigger issue.

At the end of the day, though, it’s still THEIR server. You don’t have to like that fact, but it is a fact and you have to deal with it. Nobody else does, nor should, dictate how it’s run, unless they’re willing to pay the bills. This goes for devs and users alike.

Next time you wanna rebut a post, do it without the logical fallacies.

I understand that you do not like Third-Party advantages (I.E Admins powers) in games like this but take a moment to realize what you just said. You said

That basically solves your problem, which I assume (and correct me if I am wrong) is admin abuse. If you want a server where admins can’t have any power over game play I insist you buy your own server.

Pretty sure I play on your server (Moose?), and I agree that you’re an excellent example of an admin who users their powers in a responsible way. Don’t think I’ve ever seen you abuse them, and love seeing things like mazes and arenas that you build. It’s always just for the benefit of the server and doesn’t affect anyone negatively.

Unfortunately most admins lack that characteristic. Thanks for not being one of them.

You can go nearly an hour??? Dammit I can’t go 30 seconds and yes I’m being serious. You are bang on right though. Since running my server I no longer get to play. However I love it. Anyone can rent a server but keeping it populated night after night well that’s another thing. My 100 man server runs at near capacity, I have 4 others as admins and 2 moderators and we are constantly asked for help or to run events. Keeping the balance of fairness and enjoyability is ridiculously hard. There’s so many other servers out there to choose from so to get this right is almost a full time job in itself.

I’m not complaining though it’s very satisfying to see how well my server is doing and the feedback is great but yes I will spawn my own stuff in and build for fun if I get 5 mins peace. Is that admin abuse? Is that affecting other players, do I raid? The answer is no.

Thanks for hanging in there with us. I appreciate you playing on my server. I try to always keep it fun and fair for everyone. Also, Thanks for your compliments. Means I’m doing my job right.

[editline]22nd February 2015[/editline]

Oh my word. I’m pretty sure there’s no way In hell I would handle a 100 person server.

sorry spirit, but it is their server, paid for and operated by them regardless of how well they do it. good admins should be able to do whatever they want without being limited by the behavior of dickhead admins.

the only people with rights to force players/admins to do anything are the devs, and they do that by controlling what the game allows an admin to do. as players it’s not a right to play on someone else’s server, nor to tell them how to run it. but if those admins abuse players, those players will leave and they will have an empty server, so they end up screwing themselves over anyway by being assholes.

Noted mrknifey… I have a ton of hours in Rust and have put up with my share of abuse. -damn wolves :slight_smile:
This was just an attempt to rattle the chains a bit as I know FP is always looking at balance, even for server admins.

I was also considering the many servers where censorship or rules are in place and are intended to guide the paying user/client to the better experience. I just thought there could be a way to give the admins the tools they need without full carte blanche as players and a temptation to abuse. I guess its the price difference between the server costs and the client costs that rule. “Might makes right”. :slight_smile:

its not exactly a ton of money to run a server, you can get a 50 slot server with a decent host for under 15 bucks a month.

Lol, This exactly. I’d say 30 seconds max before someone needs something. I’ve run game servers for 11 years now for a lot of different games but I gotta say this beast we call Rust is a whole new animal lol. I enjoy it most of the time though or I wouldn’t be doing it. And I haven’t actually played the game since about 2 months after zombies were removed from legacy.

I honestly feel sorry for admins on these servers. I am friends with, and in Teamspeak with the admins on a Canada Server. We were building a HUGE maze (crashed the server with it, oops) for the players to run with good items at the end. She was turning it daylight so we could see, and the people on the server were, well, assholes. “Admin abuse” and how can I kill if it isn’t night and I was trying to raid waah waaah. My favorite is “can you TP me to my friend?”.

It is like kindergarten trying to admin a Rust server.

The minority opinion- this topic will continue to go nowhere, repeatedly, as long as people are unwilling to have a substantive conversation on what generally separates appropriate from inappropriate admin behavior… without resorting to lazy canned responses like “admins have a rough time” and “they paid for it, they can do what they want”. We know it’s their server… it’s a question of “ought”, not “can”.

A commitment to transparency, a distinction between personal building and “server projects”, advanced notice on all disruptive changes and clear separation of on-duty and off-duty status will go a long way towards setting your players’ minds at ease and increase the likelihood they’ll go to bat for you against bullshit accusations of abuse. The last one is particularly important… make it so that nobody even has to ask what status you were in when you shot them, and when the children start chirping like hungry annoying baby birds your established players will hopefully remind them you don’t have your admin hat on.

I know it’s rough running a server by yourself, with all the trolls and griefers and hackers that smear their way across the serverscape. Running a recent server solo is a full-time job, for the time you’re logged in. I came to terms with that, and decided against running a server.

Here’s another minority opinion:
There are only so many server options. If there were more community-encouraged standards for admin conduct, maybe all the good solo admins wouldn’t feel like they had to run their own standalone project, and could link up with like-minded admins to work in shifts on fewer, better-run, better-protected, more content-rich servers. That would benefit everyone, except the greedy hosting companies.

on the last 3-4 community servers i played on, i found out after a while that the admin were giving stuff to their friends. sometime they were open about it, after playing for 1 hour, i met this guy randomly and he give me free stuff. then he give me 50k wood and tons of AK… sucks. he gave the same to half of the server.

another server the admin and his 3 friends were all rolled up in armor and AK, pockets full of C4. He destroyed all the house on his way. when confronted about it, he completely deny it. server went ape shit, we try to raid the 8 story whole metal house of the admin, he shoot us, we ragequit. always hte same story.

its so hard to find a non-official, non-laggy, populated, fair server. (at least it is here in asia).

@murdo: unfortunately, right and wrong admin behaviour is too subjective to get a real concensus on; the best outcome (IMO) is for players to acknowledge that admins can do what they want on their servers, but have to suffer the consequences of their actions. players should support servers that do things the way they approve of, and walk out on people they feel abuse their admin powers.

that said, some kind of talks between server owners about what they think is appropriate use of powers, or the terminology that declares what kind of behavior you can expect on the server would probably help with consistency between servers, which in turn will moderate what the community expects from an admin.

a bit like a franchise i guess; it’s a matter of creating a standard of behavior, and a standard of server descriptions that allow people to have reasonable and informed expectations of the services they will receive.

Thats one weird Asian flag