Balance C4 please

Ok whats the point of having different tiers of material if they all are almost the same strength

I Suggest the following for balance

0 … desctruction of twig
1 c4 or axe …destruction of wood
2 C4… destruction of stone
3 C4…destruction of metal
4 C4…destruction of Armored

This seems very obv to me

any thoughts

i think their trying out a new plan, best to wait and see how they deal with it

How do you know have the devs posted any intent

Yeah somewhere i cant remember where i read it but i think garry was saying helk wanted to change the balance for the tier healths.

The Rustafied blog?

  • from the 5th March post

yep that’s it, i did look there but not hard enough :slight_smile:

That is such a dumb suggestion. 4 C4 for amoured do you have any idea how much c4 it would take to get into one building. Just no This game has a big focus on pvp and raiding everyone house should be raidable. If you build smart it would be alot harder to be raided then someone who builds poorly.

as thor and idy said, they’re testing out damage reduction, so they are setting the hp identical for now. no point debating how many c4 each panel should take just yet.

I think it should be:
1 C4 or a metal hatchet for Wood Tier
2 C4 for Stone Tier
2 C4 for Scrap Metal Tier
3 C4 for Armored Tier

Ok so at current material rates it takes the farming of 25 sulfur ore nodes to get the sulfur to craft the two C4 that it takes to blow up a single armored wall, yet you get enough metal for three armored walls out of a single metal ore node.

How is this not only strongly IN FAVOR of the homeowner, but extremely unbalanced for raiders?

Seriously, you think it should take 50 (FIFTY) sulfur ore nodes to blow up a single armored wall?! The title of your thread and subsequent content are laughable.

What’s the purpose of scrap metal? It has less HP than wood/stone.

What I assumed was Stone and Wood had more HP, but we’re vaulnerable to melee. And sheet metal wasn’t. However currently 1 C4 seems to work on all tiers except armor, which makes the HP irrelevant. Especially as melee is so ineffective now.

Yeah, what is the point of scrap metal? Does it have some special ability that makes it better than stone?

And, we should never upgrade to scrap unless we can upgrade to armored?

I have to totally agree with this. The amount of sulphur required to create the charges needed to blast into a well designed armoured base is many times more than is required to create the armoured base. Sulphur yields out of sulphur nodes are very low, and they’re significantly outnumbered by the other node types. This strongly favours builders over raiders. I’ve rarely raided a well designed armoured base where it didn’t take at least 6 charges to be able to get anything of value. Sometimes I’ve blown through as many as 10 and still didn’t get to everything in a large base.

Anyone suggesting that the cost to blast into bases should be higher are builders with zero experience raiding. I’m all for balancing things, the suggestions in this thread for raising the cost of raiding are ridiculous.

when defending, the attacker should have the disadvantage, it shouldnt be balanced

[editline]15th March 2015[/editline]

it should be like that

This is what I wrote before about raiding…

I still think it’s a bad idea to raid with normal tools. Melee raiding is way too easy and not hard to macro. A large group of players can fuck up a server like this in no time. Swarming over the server at night when nobody plays.

Raiding should be hard and rewarding and house upgrades should be only possible with specific research/construction plans/blueprints.

I know people don’t like this idea but I really think this will work.

Anyway, my balancing will look something like this (based on C4 raiding):

Normal tools for Twig Tier (And also for this)
1 C4 for Wood Tier
2 C4 for Stone Tier
3 C4 for Scrap Metal Tier
4 C4 for Armored Tier

A lot more time goes into building than just mining and smelting for walls, and then there is the time spent gathering loot to put in that base. That’s what you should be weighing against your time spent mining for sulphur. I also feel it should be balanced to the point that hitting bases for loot alone (material cost vs gain) isn’t worth it. Otherwise it turns into a self fueling process and everyone gets steamrolled. It should be a combination of strategy, security, revenge, etc plus loot that tips the scales in favor of attacking and it should be an event you have to save up for. Building anything that people actually want to raid takes days. Why should sulphur farming take an hour?

Since testing and feeling out the protections of each tier is the motivation for the even HP at present, this is all just fodder really.

All the same, it is worth noting that the amount of resources a builder has expended on his refuge are not limited to only the walls, foundations, nor other building elements, but also the LOOT those elements are intended to safeguard. I think it is indeed reasonable to be required to dump 4 charges into an armor-plated barrier before it will give way, regardless of the resource cost of said armor. If a group of raiders stands to walk away with 5 (or more) inventories full of armor, guns, resources, etc., then they should have had to spend an inventory or two worth of charges to get there.

To adequately do justice to a discussion about balance, all variables need be considered.

My two (obsolete Canadian) pennies.

Oh btw: This is true, crafting C4 is expensive. But hey, stuff still needs to be balanced. I’m ok if C4 was a bit cheaper to make. But on the other hand (what Unemphatic also said): when defending, the attacker should have the disadvantage. Rust isn’t all about raiding, please keep that in mind.

I don’t mind C4 being expensive to make. It takes a lot of time and resources to make them, and I’m ok with that. C4 should only be available to those who are willing and able to put in the time and resources required to acquire it.

I wouldn’t even be against increasing the C4 requirement to get into armoured buildings. But at the same time, there needs to be more sulphur available if that’s the case, because as it currently stands with the availability of suplur nodes and their respawn rate, increasing the C4 requirement wouldn’t be viable.

Raiding should be an investment. Building takes time and so should preparing for raids. Since most raiders target buildings with sleeping people, the buildings are pretty much defenseless as long as raiders got enough C4.