Removing Demolish from hammer opinion plus few bugfix I really hope u to do.

I heard you guys want to remove demolish from hammer due to complete base destruction after raid.
I really hope u wont do this, reason:
This will allow base griefing once again, which was the most terrible thing there was on rust past times (puttin few metal walls to block house once u got building privis from cupboards), base griefing is just the same as complete destruction, or even worse since there will be tons of abandoned bases that will make every1 lagg more.
Main Cupboard is the heart of ur base, u got to protect it even more than ur treasure boxes, if your enemies manage to hit you at ur heart, you just lost, game over, and in case you deserve to have your base completely destroyed no matter what.

Now i want to list a pair of bugs that i think its imperative for you to fix ASAP.
I really hope you guys are actually aware that there is a HUGE bug that can make you to sneak inside others bases by passing throught base parts you dont see after u logged into the game.
I want to be honest, i used this bug many times aswell as many other players did, I can easily do this bug whenever I WANT since i got to know how it works.

Another big bug is the possibility to build diagonal floors, allowing u to bug stability system and build huge bridges usefull to raid bases avoiding cupboards range.

Put togheter those 2 bugs, and u will be able to raid any base on the server, no matter how big it is, or where it is (on da rock or into the water).

You’d rather they demolish your building completely in less than a minute than risk that they’d spend a bunch of resources building walls in your house?

Admittedly I’m uneasy about the removal of the demolish feature. Once a base is raided completely it’s typically abandoned permanently, and ends up just sitting around causing lag or looking ugly. I’m all in favor of being able to totally demolish a base after infiltrating it’s cupboard. Granted doing it all near instantly seems a bit silly, but not being able to seems a bit MORE silly. Realistically I can see the logic in not tearing down a home. IRL nobody would tear down a house that they rob, and once it’s been abandoned there’s an opportunity for a squatter to take it over and make it their own.

Also, if you just seal your cupboard in a fully enclosed 1x1 it’s very unlikely that raiders will get to it without wasting precious C4.

I think having abandoned houses scattered across the landscape adds that certain ‘Je ne sais quois’ and atmosphere, which I am a fan of. However I am also a bigger fan of clean, sexy landscapes and freeing up server resources by demolishing anything not inhabited.

I’m open to change, but I hope we can weigh the pros and cons a bit while we’re trying different things and see if there’s a better choice. If you’re against instantly demolishing bases once the cupboard is reached, maybe try making the parts decay like they used to instead of instantly go away(from the demolish feature) or just decay naturally when they haven’t been used in a while (like in legacy).

UNLESS you’re really close to implementing structural aging in which case it could actually be cool to see abandoned buildings slowly become part of the landscape. I say slowly because if a house grows grass on the walls in 2 in-game days I’m going to notice and lose a bit of immersion. If this were the case, I’d still be in favor of natural decay over time, but maybe just a much longer time since we now have the capacity to handle it.

The last 2 days I used the demolish function a lot as I’m new to the game and build my base rather crap. I had to demolish all the walls to be able to add support posts and the rebuild the walls for stability. If I had to do it without the demolish function I would have had to use a huge amount of time and resources to fix my error as I don’t have c4 blueprint yet.

Even if I later decide to extend my own base the amount of resources to needed just to remove the old walls after the new ones are build would be quite a lot, would it not?

Quote from my Reddit post

I think keeping the demolish feature and converting it to more of a salvaging feature could change it a bit. Perhaps instead of just causing the parts to disappear, players have to destroy it with tools over time and can get some materials back for it. This way, players could be like flies on shit, going from abandoned house to abandoned house tearing off the scrap to collect for their own base. Kind of like the natural life recycling process. This would also support the theme in design that Rust is going for where everything is a hodge podge of scrap put together from different random objects to make something new.

You log on one morning and find that someone has stolen some of the HP from your wooden walls, and its your job to either collect wood to fix it, or steal wood from someone else’s standing house the same way.

Also, with the removal of the demolish feature you can pretty much kiss goodbye all the cool builds you used to feature in the dev blogs, because none of that big impressive stuff would be possible without the ability to correct mistakes after the fact.

The demolish feature should be an admin thing only so we can keep people from barricading rad towns and so we can remove glitch bases and other stuff the admin would find that tool useful, my 2 cents.

Maybe add durability to wooden hammers and let people demo/recover mats over time. To prevent easy afk tool raiding, only allow the wooden hammer to work if you have building privilege. The time necessary would be well under destroying with regular tools. I think simply adding a decent amount of time to demo griefing will stop a lot of it and people will still be able to scavenge most of the abandoned raided bases.

Edit/ I’d put material recovery somewhere in the neighborhood of rewarding people for cleaning up the landscape or just above collecting with a stone axe so new players to a server or people that decimate all the nearby resources or need emergency mats have another option if houses are nearby. Obviously, any higher and it might backfire.

/edit

Building is most of my motivation to play and the thought of burning through tools, guns, C4, and time to expand or rework defense flaws sounds more than inconvenient. As long as it takes to gather now, having to demo metal walls hurts bad enough.

I’m very happy with being able to plan builds with twig though.

Garry, in both cases i will be unable to recover my house, also, a well placed pair of metal ceilings can completely gtfo you from ur base( unless u can craft c4, and feel the need to waste it to recover ur base, like it was on legacy), and they cost literally nothing.

in one case, there will remain nothing of your house (or just flying stuff), in the other it will remain an abandoned lagg making and space wasting base.

Anyway i assure you that most of the raids (atleast in facepunch servers) are being made by abusing the two bugs i listed you, since u can sneak to the cupboard and take the privileges in the hard case, and simply destroying with a ranged weapon the cupboard once u got sight of it and the replacing it with ur own one, in the easy case.
If u cant sneak to the cupboard from the terrain level, then u just need to build the bug bridge using diagonal floors to get on the roof (cupboard range is 30m, and 30m deals u 50/60 fall dmg), once u are on the roof, u use the ghost walls bug to get inside and the raid is done.

I’ve said this before in some other threads – allow code locks on cupboards. Then raiders can only demolish the cupboard and cannot authorize to allow them to insta-demolish the house.

Once all cupboards in range are demolished, the raider can add their own and do whatever they want, so the balance is maintained.

All for salvaging, further in the decay timeline for buildings.

Why not have the cupboard fade first which will leave scraps open for salvaging after a week. While owning the cupboard will just let you salvage whatever is on your property, granted it will take some time and you have to stand next to the area.

Perhaps new tools solely for this purpose? Along with lockpicks, circuitry toolkits, and others needed for salvaging.

I’m not one to complain too much, atleast in public but the decision to remove the Hammer’s destroy ability clearly wasn’t thought about properly…

The only “pro” about this decision allows raiders to not fully destroy a base after raiding it (I actually think this is a con, fully destroying a base cleans up the server, always new people to build in that spot and aesthetically makes the server not look like s**t).

Anyways, enough about that, that is not the problem. Here are all the “cons” about removing the Hammers destroy ability.

  • You make 4 walls and lock yourself in your base, this is a very viable tactic before you’ve learned Code Locks or before you’ve made a Furnace. Your only way of getting in and out of your base is to destroy a wall and rebuild in it’s place, and vice versa. This is no longer an option, instead now we’re just going to build a doorway and door and put a dumb twig stairs in front of it.

  • I build up something small to get started, maybe a 2x2 that is 3 stories high. It’s a good way to get started on a server since it’s protected for the time being and has enough floors for me to avoid the wall glitchers. I put my crates and sleeping bags on floors 2 and 3. I want to expand my base now, make it a 3x3 instead allowing me more room to put Furnaces… etc. I can’t do this anymore unless I plan on wasting all my hatchets taking down the 2x2 walls on all 3 floors.

  • Raid Towers… while re*****ed in the first place, these are going to be an even bigger eye sore now. Most people are still building twig raid towers and that is not a problem, but a smart raider will know better and upgrade his first few levels to wood. Going to see a bunch of ugly raid towers everywhere.

  • Did someone just raid you? Gained access to your tool cupboard. Well, they can’t tear down your house now, but if they wanna be dicks theyll throw up 3 Metal Walls around your entrance doors. Now you cant get in or leave your base, which is even worse then them tearing it all down to begin with.

hell no. i’ll break down any walls they put up. scrap the cupboard entirely;)

agree with reclaiming resources by tearing down walls. agree with implementing decay to slowly destroy abandoned buildings, while allowing players to take over ruins/maintain their own properties integrity.

although i suppose you should know best regarding big builds, i would think that the twig pieces would be relatively easy to use in terms of demolishing incorrectly placed pieces. maybe admin spawn a shotty or something equally effective at clearing panels, and do it that way. probably take about as long as right clicking to destroy it, but correct me if i’m wrong;)

  1. that was never how it was intended to work, it’s just the way it ended up being (ab)used. yes, i suppose you could do the same with a set of stairs, but it’s a bit like pillar ladders in legacy.

  2. walls miraculously falling down because we will it to do so is both lazy and unrealistic. i’d happily trade having to beat down 3 walls manually for the knowledge that a raider who works nights as a dick can’t demolish my entire base without working reasonably hard at it.

  3. raid towers are a response to the no build zone. personally i’d sooner see the whole thing scrapped; i promise you, as soon as people can build directly onto the house they are raiding, the towers will go away for good, except for the basejumpers.

  4. so the permissions thing is redundant without some kind of protection such as a lock, and even that has limited worth. so scrap it. balance out the hp/damage ratio for all of the panels properly so if it happens, you can break it down with sufficient investment. or if you have a twig/wood house, reshape it. thank the assholes for 3 stone walls you didn’t have to pay for, and move your door to another panel somewhere else. unless they surround your entire base with walls, you can work around it. and even then, break down a wall or move house. this ones less about the destroy function, and more about griefers.

I’m in complete agreement with this. If raiders get to the tool cupboard(s), they have to expend the resources to destroy the walls / door to get to it in the first place and then have to destroy it and build their own in order to destroy a base.

It would solve the current base griefing issue and keep the functionality of a building owner being able to easily tear down parts to expand their base.

I think removing the demolish functionality is basically curing the disease by killing the patient.

Yeah twig parts aren’t the problem. It’s when you’ve already converted everything to stone or higher, and suddenly realize you forgot to place a very important pillar that is now blocked. That already drives me crazy and thats WITH the demolish feature. Technically if you are admin you can use guns or C4 or whatever, but everytime I abuse C4 for the sake of fixing one of my errors I feel bad for other players in the server who have to hear 3-4 explosions all at once, both because it can get annoying when done repeatedly and because they are then worried about raiders and the like.

If there’s a way to get rid of the cupboard but still allow demolishing I’m all for it, but I think removing the demolish feature now with no alternative is a bit hasty and it’s going to cause a lot of frustration. Whenever the devs make a major change like this that people either aren’t ready for (like the metabolism change, upcoming climate/temperature change) it tends to cause a shitstorm and in most cases they have to take back what they did until there’s something to soften the transition.