[Suggestion] Remove Explosive Charge and add...

As I have read a number of other people suggesting to remove military weapons and replace them with weapons that would be more suitable for crafting in a post apocalyptic setting, I also think it would be beneficiary to remove the Explosive Charge and replace it with either a battering ram or catapult. These items could be crafted but possibly could have some strict crafting caveats, ie only craftable at your base/multiple people needed to craft/long crafting times etc. Using items such as battering rams or catapults would allow people to enter someones home in a manner that would be more “realistic” in a setting such as this game. However there could be drawbacks to using them, they would have to be carried/pushed to their location, meaning that multiple people are needed to use such items. For instance, 4 people needed to carry/use battering ram, and 4 people need to push catapult however only 2/3 people needed to use it. The battering ram would require multiple hits to open a door/wall and would also require a large surface (enough land or possible 4/6 foundations and can’t be carried up stairs) to correctly operate it. The catapult, however could require maybe 2 hits, but would have to be operated from a distance and the trajectory could be random meaning you don’t get to choose which door/wall is hit.

Anyways those are my suggestions, and i think they would really help to improve the offense and defense portion of the game. No longer would people have to worry about building houses with 1000 doors. We could actually build the houses we really wanted to build.

Some good concepts, though people would just carry the wood to a location near where they wanted to attack (likely in the middle of the night) build a foundation, build a ram, walk it 10 feet to your doorstep and then break down your door.

Point being, you can change how people get into your “base”, but it won’t really make it much more difficult.

IMO, take out metal all together as well as C4. Wood and stone only and then do what you suggest but that there is no way for breaching stone walls. That way, instead of people just making mazes, you have more people focusing on walling off their house and then it would just require a lot more effort to get to the house by going through wooden gate after wooden gate. Time is the deterrent, not the structure itself.

Thanks for the reply, but i don’t think you really read the explanation correctly. They could make it so that the ram or catapult would have to be built only at your main house/base. If/when they implement the key system, they could also have a system to determine which house is your main house. This main house could be the only one that allows you to have a workshop big enough to create/store these items. As well as giving us either only 1 attempt to label your main house, or a really long cool down period to switching your main house to a different one.

However, in response to whether or not people could just carry it 10 feet, the battering ram would still allow for breaching the first floor only, and the catapult would have to have some luck or many attempts to get the wall you wanted. Either way, having both in the game would allow for people to have better defenses, which the game seems to be lacking atm.

it doesnt matter what you do to games that are suppose to be survival. they are and will always be pvp based unless you take out the ability to kill other players. point being, it wont matter if you take out military weapons, people will still kill you and people will still raid

I don’t think you really understand or fully read the post.

I think your ideas are missing some aspects of the game that are important…

  1. Suggesting that it take more than one person to do any kind of base damage is very limiting and does not allow players to play alone.

  2. Having large restrictions on where u can place destructive items would greatly limit what door/walls are breakable. This means it would be way way way to easy to hide your items in a back room say against a rock wall or on a cliff.

If you guys have not figured it out yet, there are ways to make bases that force people to blow through a massive amount of doors (a vertical tower that you can not build stairs next to bec of pillars works great) and therefore adding limits such as these will make it impossible to get to the loot (more so than it already is…). Sorry but as long as such bases exist they should never limit our damaging power just for some people to build “pretty bases”.

I think you are missing the point as to why the destructive items need to be changed. Garry has already made a statement that they are trying to figure out a way to balance the defense system, such that people won’t need to make 1000 doors in their houses anymore. Giving us items that have limited ability to open up walls/doors would help to rectify the defense issue. Certainly, they could easily implement a single player type of battering ram, such as a sledge hammer or similar.

As it stands, I have a 7 story house built between rocks on 3 sides. No structures can be built on 3 sides of the house and i have pillars on the other side. I have doors on every single possible junction of the interior. The only thing preventing anyone from getting to the top of my house is a buttload of Explosive Charges. Even though my house is very secure, it is also very frustrating to have to go through that many doors just so i can hide a pair of Kevlar Pants. Not to mention taking forever to open and close every door when I am rushing to get out for the airdrop. Some say that is the price to pay for security, however if they were to just limit the placement of destructive items that would take care of the problem of needing many, many doors.

OP, I see what your saying and your right, something needs to be done. The point I was trying to make was that in order to limit what/how/where we can use destructive objects you would have to limit the building ability as well. The base you described sounds pretty secure and as long as the game allows u to create such bases, they should never limit our explosive power.

Again, all I’m saying is that you cant limit destruction unless you limit creation…
I would be awesome if we only had to open 2 doors to get to our vaults and it still be hard for people to get to, but if someone can still make a base like you described, it would be impossible to get to their loot under your proposed ideas.

[editline]24th January 2014[/editline]

Maybe the balance we are looking for has more to do with increasing defense and less about decreasing offense. We dont want to limit creation after all.

Sand,

I agree with your concepts. I was not taking into consideration the concept of a “home” being implemented. That’s a possibility. I think personally, I’d rather see a concept similar to mine where I suggest the use of stone walls and gates. I’d increase resource cost or reduce resource availability.

I’m sure though that as this is Alpha, they want to allow players to do A TON, so they can test the performance and mechanics.

No, not trying to play stone age simulator.

If we see Rust as somewhere where nowadays guys were lost, explosive are part of the equation, even if not C4. The knowledge exists, and many explosives can be created even without much equipment or knowledge.

Fine, metal walls. Either way, point being that we could do something that takes the emphasis off of destroying a house and it’s doors and place it on destroying gates/walls.

How about making the current “Wood Walls” able to be taken down by the owner and replaced in the inventory. Add the option to placed “Wood Walls” to “reinforce” said wall with metal. If done, it would take on the appearance of a metal wall on the outside surface, would take on the current “Metal Wall” stats, would make it so foundations could not be placed on any side with a “reinforced” wall, and no longer be able to be taken down and relocated, only destroyed. This would make building a tad easier on the builder by being able to move walls, while also adding a way to not simply have just all wood and all metal buildings as we do now. One could build a 2 story house, and only “reinforce” the lower half. I personally think this would reduce the amount of “pillar houses” that we see today as the “reinforced” walls would prevent any more foundations from being added on the outside edge.

I think that if you have a base they should not make it able for other people to build exactly next to it.

If they want to keep it realistic then you’d know that someone would build next to you.

So annoying when you got a nice base, and they find a way to ruin it, and you keep getting fudged up with pillars 'n shizzle ^^

I like the idea, but people could easily build a foundation just outside the house, not connected, and still build stairs to go up and easily jump to the wall to place c4 on it.

I suggested in another thread to get rid of C4 too. My ideas for replacements are:

-Gunpowder Barrels - Takes up entire row of inventory slots, requires large quantities of wood and gunpowder to make, and requires several barrels to take down walls and doors.

-Dynamite - Maybe a new resource of acid pools to collect Sulfuric Acid/Nitric Acid to make nitroglycerin. Acid Pools are extremely rare. Dynamite will be the most powerful explosive in the game but it has a huge downside. If it is in your inventory you must walk. If you run there is a chance it will detonate and kill you. This downside will force players to really weigh the pros and cons of raiding smaller bases. Force players to scout bases first before going to equip the explosives, force raiders to have a dynamite equipped raider that they must protect, and it will force raiders to think about how much weaponry/armor they will carry on a raid because they may lose it all if they blow themselves up.

What about claim staking your place. Then if anybody steals from you they will automatically leave a scent of theft and can be tracked back to their base. I rote more about it in my thread on the topic of game improvements.